May 01, 2005

• Your mother cat may not have any milk-my cat Morgan got pregnant at 6 months and we lost all the babies even though I was hand feeding them. As to long term, this is what I know: I got Blue, a 4 week old kitten, about a year and a half ago. I had to bottle feed him, teach him how to use the litter box, in short, gently nurture him. So he turns out to be the crankiest little sob on the planet-he bit me in the face three times, striking just like a snake. No warning. There are scars. Vets tell me that kittens raised without their mother have "no manners" and are frequently ill tempered. So I would think you should try to keep the mother cat around as much as possible. She is telling them things you don't know. Even if she is a less than perfect mother cat she is still a cat. Also, it sounds like you are doing a great job with them-raising newborn kittens is not easy.
• Do get your cats NEUTERED before you are neck-deep in kittens, Jerry, no fooling. Let the mother cat assume as much of their care as she will. Grooming them is a big part of their socialization process. She needs to be washing them frequently -- if she's not, you'll have to. Use a well wrung-out terry-cloth first moistened in warm water -- with it, gently wipe their stomachs for ten or fiteen seconds as well as cleaning up any ness present. The action of tongue on belly area is necessary for young kittens and puppies both to digest their food properly. Your kittens may go more than a couple of hours between feedings if you do this. Gentle pressure, as if stroking them -- the terrycloth is as close as you can come to the rough texture of a mother cat's tongue. Good luck. And don't forget abotu the neutering!
• Only get them neutered when they start 'showing' - that is, the females start 'presenting' and acting out of the ordinary. Normally this doesn't start for several months. I think you're safe for now, but certainly everyone with un-neutered cats should do the world & cat-kind a favour and have 'em neutered as soon as is healthy. The terrycloth trick is a good one.
• Excellent, bees, and thanks Chyren. She does have milk, at least during day-time hous. But at night she doesn't want to feed them. :-( They seem to really like that tummy trick, though, later in the day and in the early morning so thanks for that! Here they are, BTW. Dear lord, she's only 10 months old herself! I got her brother (the father) neutered a few weeks ago, but during the time between his shots and his surgery he knocked her up. She will get spayed as soon as her next heat cycle is over and the kittens are weaned (according to the internets). It's just scary being a "father".
• NIce looking kittens, good to see she's giving them some care. Have knowm cats as young as six month to deliver kittens, they are an appallingly fecund species. Jerry, I hate to mention this, but it's possible Mama Cat is even now gestating a second litter -- cats are one of the few mammals able to manage that trick -- hope she isn't, though.
• My sister has literally hand-fed over a hundred kittens from newborn through adulthood, so I'm no expert in taking care of them, but I can definitely tell you how they socialize: So long as the litter is somewhat together, they will socialize with other cats just fine, so don't worry about that. And cats (if you don't neuter them) who were hand-raised will often have trouble raising their first litter, but their second and subsequent litters rarely have the same sort of neglect issues. This of course will vary cat by cat. Some hand-raised mother cats do perfectly from the get-go. As for human socialization, what you are doing is actually one of the best things: hand-raised kittens (though not ideal, they should be mother-raised) are often perfect housecats, especially when they stay in the household that raises them. They're normal in just about every way that I know, but they absolutely love human affection. One of the cats my sister raised, "Tiny" (who was a runt they didn't think would make it), loved being petted so much by people that anytime we were over, she made the rounds, and not in the typical scent-marking way, she'd jump up on your lap and rub her head into wherever your hand happened to be. So don't worry much, but for the sake of fellow-kitty socialization, keep them together with their litter-mates and their mom at least for the 12 weeks recommended. And yes, get them all spayed as soon as the Humane Society vets recommend.
• Y'all monkeys are sweet. How are you with ferrets?
• her brother (the father) Gross.
• I love tabbies in particular. My first friend in this world was a nursing mother tabbie, she was called "Tits". I don't know why. It may have been her large, distended mammary glands :) Anyway, just give 'em lots of licks. Cats who've grown up humanised are the best kinds of friends to have.
• Cute standard tabby Jerry!! I agree with the socialization comments above - I don't think you have to worry about these kitties if they all grow up with each other, with humans, and with mommacat. Kittens learn a lot from each other and their primary socialization period is long; at 2 weeks they're just fuzzy worms. Later on (8-16 weeks and onwards), avoiding too much rough and tumble play with your hands is best, or they'll think of humans as big chew-toys; use 'remote' toys (like mousies and fishing rod toys) instead. Gentle handling of all parts of their little fuzzy selves helps as well (eg ears, grooming body). Lots of cuddles. They'll learn about litter trays from mommacat. Cats are amazing. Don't forget your veterinarian clinic is a valuable resource: they should be able to give you the best advice. Get everyone dewormed with something from a vet clinic (you know it's safe then), make sure mommacat is on a decent food (usually a good quality kitten food, but no abrupt changes please). Vaccines for babies can start at 8 weeks and if mommacat isn't vaccinated then check with your vet when it's safe to do so (might vary with vaccine type). Momma can be spayed as soon as she has weaned the kitties. The kitties can be spayed and neutered at 6 months of age (some shelters are spaying them at 12 weeks and it doesn't seem to do them a button of harm). Don't wait until anyone's in season because (a) cats get pregnant at the drop of a hat (b) spaying a cat in-season is uaully more expensive (because the uterus and blood vessels are all bigger and more fragile) and (c) when they go into season cats keep cycling until they get mated. Having kittens in the house is a steep learning curve: I discovered that cats can quantum tunnel, can fit behind the fridge, and climb up stuff and not get down, will eat the only toxic houseplant within a 30 mile radius, and are very interested in trying to get into the central heating system if at all possible. Good luck and have fun!
• I have five two-week-old kittens on my hands, literally. wow, that's impressive, being able to type with 5 kittens sitting on top of your hands!
• LOL rochiebones. They keep falling off... at 2 weeks they're just fuzzy worms Oh, for sure! That is a prefect description. Worms with claws! Well, I certainly came to the right place, as I did when I got mom and pop last summer. Thank you so much chimaera and wasneme for youir counsel. Fortunately I can keep them for as long as it takes and as I work at homeI am always around. And with music students coming and going the kittens will get to meet lots of friendly humans before they head off to new homes. Here is the oblivious dad ("Whoa, fuzzy worms that cry... Hey, a fly on the wall! WHEEEEEEE!). Don't even think that, bees. :-(
• I've got some pics of the litter Like this, JJ?
• Ha, wendell. Who knew you were British? ;-) When they wake me up at 3:57am they are indeed a pile of trash.
• Jerry Jr: Just feel free to ship that naughty boy my way. He grew up BOOOTIFUL! Mama's cute, as are the rats, but Papa's pretty special. Big Davey: So, you have a litter of littler ferrets?
• Big Davey, yes, tell us more about your ferrets, or ask away... I had house ferrets for about 10 years. None right now, though. If I don't know or know where to look something up, I know people to ask.
• New monkeys interested in early story of Jerry's Mama Cat and her siblings see this.
• >> her brother (the father) > Gross. That's what I thought when I was around 8; I didn't think it was possible 'cuz brothers & sisters can't get married. (If you think that's bad, when I was 6 I thought kissing a girl on the mouth made babies.) The thing is, incest in the animal kingdom doesn't mean quite what it does under human laws. It's always Chinatown when you're a quadruped.
• It's always Chinatown when you're a quadruped. Buh?
• Derail:On the subject of kittens... Kitten War. May the cutest kitten win.
• That is serously addictive. You can also add your own kitten and watch their stats.
• I don't know exactly what you mean, Big Davey. Chinese tend to be even more conservative when it comes to marriage. Many older folk won't even consider it if both parties have the same surname, even if they're not related at all. And I believe even today, marrying someone from the same village is still a no-no, because they're likely to be related, even if it's from several generations back. Just sayin'.
• I think Big Davey is referring to the film Chinatown (plot summary here, relevant bit is in the 10th paragraph).
• Ah, right. Weird.
• Oh dear, bees, that last post of mine in the previous thread was indeed prophetic. Alas, not prophylactic as I left it two weeks too long... And BlueHorse, BB is indeed a handsome fella, and an hyperactive love pig as well. With a foot fetish. And with an unnatural ability to break into any forbidden space in my apartment seemingly by simply looking at it. A truly talented cat who's incessant activity today makes your offer very appealing.
• The kittens are doing great, BTW. Eyes all open, clearly smelling and hearing for the most part, and trying to travel. A lot of individual personalities emerging as well, which surprises me. One obvious leader and one runt. Thanks again for the great advice and I'll try to post some more pics.
• They are all happy and momma-cat is doing her job. The kittens are starting to piss me off and that is good, I hope.
• Next question: Jerry, what are ye going to do with all the kittens?
• Five four-week-old kittens fighting for the teats of a small mother cat makes a ruby scrum look gentle. :-0
• All the kittens will likely find homes with my students or good people they know. But I think I might have to keep the Gimp, bees. There is indeed a runt here, a runt with a heart of gold. I swear it's smarter than the rest.
• Daresay it's had to be. Competing with greedy big siblings doubtless helps to develop the brain.
• Isn't it funny of people, that we do like the runts? I've always had a soft spot for them. Yet, I don't think we especially like our own runts - we like tall, strong people. Why the difference?
• Great question, jb, but I gotta say this runt is coming in to it's own (kittens are notoriously hard to sex so I won't try yet). He/she is by far the most couragous and adventurous kitten of the five in the litter, and SUPER-friendly too! and that is saying a lot given that this is the week when they have invaded the whole apartment and I can't seem to do much to stop it. They are incredibly quick when they find their legs! They are sleeping very near me and so I constructed a high pillow barrier that I thought would dissuade any adventurer from intruding on my sleep. So much for that plan: the runt climbed up three stories of pillows (about eight times it's body length at least) and dropped down on me while I slept. They are either without fear or stupid. That is a big drop! Maybe they are just elastic. Such a fall and no harm done! I am lovin' this runt! The rest are cool, but this cat has won my heart. :-) I don't know what to say: being a smaller person doesn't mean you can't be great. Anybody can make an impression. These kittens have personalities. Some of them are starting to piss me off! Two of them are nobodies. Three of them are people. I am fucked.
• And bees, I don't think so: this is just a sweet slow cat who manages to find my heart faster than the rest. I might just keep it. That's some smarts. :-)
• Jerry, name it Napoleon (^_^)
• Heh. Ah, Jerry. I know a love song when I hear it sung.
• jb, I think our liking for the runts has something to do with the attraction we have to infants and young things. They're small, have unformed facial features, higher voices, and tend to be appealing because of needing special care. Neoteny is the word for that infantile look, and tho we like it in animals for all of their lives, we are not so tolerent of it in people at times.
• It's also the reason Disney characters are so appealing.
• And alot of anime characters (big eyes, small mouths, unformed features etc...)
• Don't find this idea too convincing. Never found Mickey Mouse's high-pitched voice attractive -- it's disagreeable to listen to. Disliked him even as a kid. Much prefer Beatrix Potter's mice to Disney's mice. And I prefer Tenniel's Alice illustrations to any of the visual images in Disney's Alice. Same story with Shepherd's illustration vs the Disney Pooh ensemble.
• Here is an excellent, really detailed essay by Stephen Jay Gould, comparing Mickey to a human infant:

  He has assumed an ever more childlike appearance... The Disney artists transformed Mickey in clever silence, often using suggestive devices that mimic nature's own changes by different routes. To give him the shorter and pudgier legs of youth, they lowered his pants line and covered his spindly legs with a baggy outfit. (His arms and legs also thickened substantially--and acquired joints for a floppier appearance.) His head grew relatively larger- and its features more youthful. The length of Mickey's snout has not altered, but decreasing protrusion is more subtly suggested by a pronounced thickening. Mickey's eye has grown in two modes: first, by a major, discontinuous evolutionary shift as the entire eye of ancestral Mickey became the pupil of his descendants, and second, by gradual increase thereafter.

  And he continues, but it's too long to quote. Gould's basically saying that Mickey changed over time, starting out a fairly "adult" character but becoming physically more childlike over the next fifty-ish years. I had to read this essay at university for a course in "popular culture" and it (like the late Gould) is one I'm fond of. Maybe "appealing" was the wrong word; maybe I should have used "marketable". Disney's characters are far more well-known (thanks mostly to promotional materials) than Shephard's or Tenniel's, especially by children -- who maybe see Mickey and co. as peers of a sort -- or Potter's characters, who seem to belong more to an older generation these days in any case.
• Marketable these days seems to mean a business or conglomerate puts money into developing/publicizing products which are tie-ins to a film (board games, figurines, comic strips, stuffed toys, etc). Disney was the ground-breaker, I believe, in this field. Mine was among the first generations exposed from childhood on to the Disney image-deluge, but I never owned or wanted to own a Mickey Mouse anything, even the Mickey Mouse comic books which were fairly ubiquituous in the late forties and early fifties, turned me off. Marketing strategy of Disney got far more sophisticated in recent decades, with Pooh and Tigger-printed fabrics being made into bedsheets and coverlets and pajamas and so on, images appearing in a much wider range of items than was the case when I was small. Believe the most radical alterations in Mickey's image happened prior to World War II, when Steamboat Willy transmogrified into the juvenile Mickey to be seen in The Sprceror's Apprentice sequence in Fantasia. I encountered Steamboat Willy in the midfifties, and found him startling andf more interesting than the later Mickey.
• The Mickey of Fantasia (1940?) is just about the same as the one I grew up with in the 80s.
• Hi folks! A bit of an update and another question.... They are driving me crazy! Seven cats in a two-bedroom apartment... These kittens are more like mini-orcs than Mickey Mouse. The runt continues to excell at everything. The runt is a reincarnation of somebody and seems to prefer "Napoleon" to his previous moniker, "The Gimp". Thanks Alnedra! /update What is the best way to litter train five kittens? I have been finding (feeling) wet spots (ahem) for a few days now--it's nice that nursing kitten pee doesn't smell as foul as kibble-eating cat pee--but today they got their first taste of processed food so I am expecting the volume of solid waste to increase. Yay! I have set up a separate litter tray for them (low sides, non-scented clay) in a quiet spot. Some of the internets say that Mom will show them the way, but I have my doubts. I am thinking that I may have to keep the kittens in my bedroom and lock the parents out (Mom and Dad: mmmm, kitten food... I want! Fresh litter? Even better!). Any advice about this stage (they will be six weeks old tomorrow) will be much appreciated.
• Think ye might be better off with more litter trays for now -- in a pinch ye can use cut-down cardboard boxes lined with plastic bags. Think letting the kittens watch the elder cats use litter pans is a good idea. If ye're worried about the adults eating kitten food just put down lots more food, more litter pans -- one per cat/kitten is a good idea. Keep 'em scrupulously clean to encourage kitten use. In any case, in two weeks time the kittens should be in new homes, so the new owners will have most to do in this regard. Ye can start lining up new owners and moving kittens out any time now. Kittens and puppoes can be given away any time after six weeks and will survive. Althouugh it's nice for new owners if they're mostly weaned by then, it's not an absolute must if the new owner is willing to take on the finishing touches. And many are, becaise very young animals are cute -- also, this is a great time for new owner and pet to bond.
• If you don't mind playing Mother Cat, take one kitten at a time to a fresh litter box, place it there, and scratch the litter with a finger as if you were a cat covering up a dump. They seem to get the idea.
• Thanks bees and path. I have tried the "dump and scratch" method that path suggests but my timing must be off because they just taste-test the litter and hop out. I will take bee's advice and place boxes around the place and keep 'em clean. I just checked the second litter box (indeed it is a box with the sides cut down and a garbage bag liner!) and there is poop, but it looks adult-size. We'll see what happens. In other news the poppa just did something terrible--I know not what--and I now know that momma can puff her tail up to about 18 times its normal size. Wow, impressive! She looked freakish and they made up immediately, touching noses and smelling each other. It was scary for a few seconds, though! I have never heard her sound that scary. It was a big dangerous sound coming out of a very small cat. Maybe he was trying to have a kitten snack or something. Whatever it was it sounded like the end of the world!
• 24-hour poop patrol. :-( But it seems to work.
• Cats are fastidious about litter-boxes; if a litter-box isn't kep[t clean, they often stop using it, alas.
• Indeed keeping the elimination space clean is good advice, bees. I just bought 8kg of litter and I feel much more secure right away. If I get lazy the whole place stinks in less than 1/2 a day. Before noon I can smell the waste. The kittens are on solid food. :-( First time in a while I've had to do this kind of cleaning day to day. When was the last time shit of any kind was central to your life? And trying to teach a kitten to not "fight" with a human hand is against god's will I think. God is in the kittens. And the sewage... and the laughter.
• Every day -- horse-poop is the most voluminous, but even tha birds are messy wee things. Luckily there are several of us who clean the stable, so it's not such a chore as it might be, but I usually end up doing the birds by myself. Now the dachshund is using the great outdoors again, a dark cloud has lifted from my daily rounds.
• We've been very, very careful to remove our bodies from the category of acceptable cat toys. (Bengal males grow very large, and they'll turn into battle cats if you give them even half an opportunity. The breeder was quite emphatic as to the importance of kitten training for our boys.) Get a box of plastic straws; keep a few straws everywhere that the kittens roam. Every time the kitten wants to chew on or spar with your hand, remove the hand and offer the straw, or another toy. Every time. It's hard -- it's fun to spar with the kitten! good sensitivity training -- but, like wasneme said, they'll otherwise learn to treat you as another clawable, chewable toy. God is certainly in the kittens. All kittens.
• Whoever originally owned my Maine coon, then abandoned him, apparently taught him to attack hands with his claws retracted. At first, we thought he had been declawed, but further examination showed that he has an impressive set. I haven't figured out how one would teach a cat that, though.
• path, some cats are smart enough to teach themselves that. There were some stray cats I used to play with who would mock-fight with me, but always with claws retracted, and never bit hard enough to break skin. They weren't so gentle with my first boyfriend though. He used to get his hands scratched to pieces.
• Our cat knows not to scratch, but not to not bite. But she does bite very lightly.
• Excellent, goetter. Thanks.
• Funny, but I think that kittens that are part of a big litter with a good kat mom learn that claws HURT. The well-socialized nicely mannered kittens in the cat world were also the most pleasant to have around people, too. Our big orange Tim cat could have probably taken off your arm had he wanted to, but he would mock fight with horrible growls, howls, and shreeeeeks while grabbing your arm with his forelegs and "disemboweling" it with his hinds. He would take your knuckles in his teeth when he did it, but never hurt anyone with either claws or jaws, unless they jerked their hands against his teeth. One amazing cat. RIP
• One the other hand, I recall visiting who friends had a big grey monster of a cat who normally appeared quite placid. The evening when I first met the beast, my friends said he loved to be petted but don't touch his belly. Throughout the visit, Frenchfry had wandered past my chair several times, stopping for a scritch behind the ears and had even sat purring in my lap for a while. Later on, he came by again so I gave him a pat, at which point he rolled over on his back, obviously looking for a tummy rub. The very instant my hand came near him he became a demon from the depths of feline hell. The mad bastard had the claws out on all four paws, shredding my shirtsleeves, ripping into my arm and hand until I was dripping with blood. After a spot of first-aid, I sat down again and the little bugger jumped up into my lap and promptly fell asleep. Cats can be scary.
• Someone once told me that when teaching a kitten to play gently, be very vocal when the cat hurts you: a loud "owww" because it sounds like a hurt cat. It seemed to work for my kitty years ago - she'd also play without using claws or biting too hard.
• Thanks, tracicle. I have many opportunities to test that method these days. The latest was when one of the kittens ran up my leg last night. I was wearing shorts. Owww indeed! Little bugger made it all the way to my shoulder. And went to sleep. *sigh* And I did get a box of straws, goetter, and some thick cord. They love it all exually when they aren't beating the living shit out of each other.
• "Exually" should be a word! I have no idea what I meant by it... I think the phone rang. :-)
• A really bad thing just happened. The mother and father went at each other like yersterday. Insane. I've never heard hate like this. This is not good. :-( Violence has scared the shit out of the babies. This is vilolent!
• THis is fucking scary. :-(
• Mom. :-(
• She is hyperviolent!
• THis is not fucking cool.
• This is bloddy. :-( They are NOT getting along and I have blood drops on my keyboard. This is insane :-( This is scary shit. Fuck's sake. OK. I am going to lock them out. Jesus, blood is red... this is crazy.
• Holy fuck this is aggressive.
• It's the goddamn PARENTS that are the problem. FUCK. THEY ARE TRYING TO KILL EACH OTHER! THIS IS NOT FUN!
• OH, Jesus, I'm just gonna let it go. An angry cat is not to be fucked with. Jesus fucking christ. They are separated and I am hostile. I am dripping bood on the floor here! I'm gonna go lick my wounds. Holy fuck! Lions/Tigers/Lynx I hope your mom/dad combo wasn't too bad... You can keep 'em! Fuch this hazard.
• This is crazy. They hate each other. Why? This is disturbing. Poor fucking kittens. This is not good. :-(
• :-(
• Alright, enough diplomacy. This is crazy.
• This is the most depressing moment of my life. The kitttens are hiding and the parents are fighting. I have never before heard such violent vocalizations. :-( Thank god for tomorrow.
• Oh dear, Jerry. My condolences. Are you any better? Are the kittens ok?
• Not to worry. I am a drama queen for sure.
• And a failed diplomat, apparently.
• The kittens are hiding, as they should. It is the "adults" that are having rouble. Eh fuck. Incredible violence. Wow. Blood looks good. Damn. We have to chill out here. They used to like each other: they made babies together! That kind of violence is just a bit mad. I mean, I like a broken hand as much as the next guy, but...
• These kitttens are in for a next three weeks. I'll say. Momma and poppa will have to settle their diffenrences.
• Recomciliation looks distant.
• This is sad and needs time. Feline hatred kicks ass.
• We're gonna sleep on it. ;-)
• I'd not read this thread before. Reading the whole thing to this point all at once...well, I'm worried. Let us know what's happened.
• Jerry, suggest you separate the parents as soon as possible -- the longer hostilities continue, the less likely they will ever get over it, frankly -- for patterns of behaviour can become de[ply and swiftly ingrained with animals. Once there's serious, sustained dislike, the consequences may be disastrous for one or both cats.
• Second what bees said. Keep them separate. Hope everything's calmed down now.
• PS this is not unusual behavior in cats. The mother sees the father as a threat to her kittens.
• Jer I think you should separate the adult cats completely and ask your vet for advice ASAP - as Koko said, Mama cat is trying to protect her kittens from the male. It is 'natural' for male cats to attempt to kill kittens in order to eliminate offspring which might not be their own and to bring the female back into season; that's evolution for you.(and no, male cats aren't smart enough to know instinctively the kittens are their own, don't go down that anthopomorphic route). I'm sorry this is happening to you, now go do somthing about it!
• "and no, male cats aren't smart enough to know instinctively the kittens are their own, don't go down that anthopomorphic route" Why is that anthropomorphic? I mean, it can't be anthropomorpic because I'm not aware that human fathers can instinctively recognize their children. Nevertheless, it might be possible that a cat could recognize kinship by smell. I'm absolutely positive that this is the case in some species and I'm guessing in some mammalian species, too. Also, you can't really have one without the other. What I mean is that if you're going to say that male cats want to kill kittens that they don't think are their own, then that is an (accepted, I know) evolutionary theory. They're trying to propogate their genes and eliminate others. But if that's the case, then there'd also be a pretty strong selective pressure to avoid killing their own offspring. I'd be surprised, really, to find this behavior very common without their being an accompanying ability to "instinctively" discern kinship. That's not to say that things will go wrong for one reason or another from time to time. This would be one of them, perhaps. Also, though, in this case, it's not necessary that the father actually be a threat to the kittens, only that the mother perceives the father to be a threat to the kittens. And there isn't nearly so much of an evolutionary pressure for her to be very picky about defending them from a male cat, father or not.
• Anyways.. *rolls eyes* They are separated. THe father is in my teaching studio and the mother is in my bedroom and never the twain shall meet, at least until the kittens are gone. And the kittnes can roam freely so long as no two doors are open at the same time. I'm really sorry, folks. I'm not normally such a drama queen but that scared the shit out of me. I thught I had left domestic violence behind me.
• You need some tiny little cat doors for the kittens. :)
• LOL I am the big cat-door-opener. God, in a word. He must be getting tired.
• OH! Jerry, you *have* to go to REI or the Target camping department and see if they'll sell/give you the tiny little display tents & sleeping bags. My kittes are too big, so I can't :o(
• I'm just getting tired. I want to drown them.
• Oh, god. BB is hurt. He is limping.
• This is NOT fun. :-(
• Jerry, take BB to the vet. It's gonna be expensive, but get him looked at. Then, call your local animal rescue group for help. They're usually filled up, but tell them in detail what your situation is and they may be able to squeeze either mom or dad in.
• Sorry for the harsh tone, but it sounds like your situation has gone downhill fast, and could get worse. Anyway, try pets911.com (takes a bit to load) for resources. Good luck to ya, Jerry. Hang in there.
• Jerry, if you can't handle this, take them all to an amimal shelter. But, you know what, my bullshit indicator has turned on. Sorry if it's wrong, but this is a lot more dramatic than any cats I've seen (in my 60 years of owning them)have gotten. Anyway, if you actually have cats, take them somewhere where they can be adopted. And, stop playing us.
• Uh, yeah ... what path said. This is a bit much, JJ. Call animal rescue if it's this bad.
• ah, i can't bring myself to call you jerry i'll call you smith
• He's OK. A broken leg. The whole scenario is ridiculous. She is so tiny but the moment one of the kittens so much as looks at him sideways and mini-hissesshe attacks. Poor bastard. No body has drowned anybody and I am sorry for being such a drama queen about the whole thing. It just scared the shit out of me and I'd had more than a few, which do doubt contributed to his current bone injury. :-((((( I haven't seen so much intense violence since I can't remember when. I just counted the individual cuts/bites on my hands. 31 and one of them might have made good use of sutures. I will be keeping the parents apart until the kittens have homes. Again, I apologize for my dramatics and I thank Tracy for removing my sodden stupid FPP. Everybody will be OK, but I will never do this again without third-party support and more rooms. It just simply scared me so much and I reacted in my current state. Too many lessons. He is amazingly stoic, sitting here beside me with his cast. Poor fucker. Thanks all, for not flaming.
• Jesus, just saw the white space. I don't suppose Tracy has time to get rid of that too? Altogether too dramatic. Life for the next week or two will be a shepherd's life: keeping the antagonists apart. Strange to say that in this case the mother is the danger, but so be it. Thanks again for your concern and calm responses.
• If mamas were not able to defend their young at need, cats would be extinct. Jerry, I know you're very fond of the kittens, but you really need to place them right away.
• She is in fine shape, bees, so the system is working. He has a broken leg and I am simptly breathless. You are right. ASAP. I have a few homes ready this week. I was hoping to keep them a couple of weeks longer but the last one seems to has stopped pissing on the floor so I will get rid of them with a clear conscience. This was fun up until about a week ago when momma got mad.
• And I will be curious to see what has changed between them permanently once their kittens are gone. Indeed I thirst for the moment. Thanks so much bees.
• I'm gonna keep them 'til Thursday when they will be exactly eight weeks.
• G*dd**n little f**kers will hide anywhere. Can I call them enemy combabtants?
• And they don't care. God bless them.
• I'd had more than a few I thought so. Maybe lighten up on the sauce a bit, ok JJ? At least while you're taking care of the little ones. And don't drink and post! I had a mama cat go squirrely on me once, when I was a kid. She just decided she wasn't going to be a mama anymore, and scattered her poor kittens everywhere. All but one were dead by the time we realized what she'd done :(
• I'm very sorry BB was injured. Hopefully, being young, he will heal fast. If mama's been annoyed for a week, go slowly when putting the parents back together once the kittens are gone. Before doing so, it may help to clean areas where the kittens were of kitten-scents, bodily scent as well as kitten-wastes. Possible mama cat may still react adversely to him if she smells kitten-scent. Clean any bedding kittens were on, your own clothing, and if possible shampoo carpeting and mop other floors. Get rid of any toys the kittens had contact with -- put them away for a while if they don't get given away with kittens. there are some products that neutralize pet urine smells that may help provided they are safe to use with cats -- I've only used ones for dogs.
• Well done, internet scientest. The father with the broken leg just got picked up by the "humane society". I had just splinted his leg and I had been nursing him for the last 48 hours AND THEY KNOCKED ON MY DOOR. I can not afford to get him back so he is effectively dead. Somebody out there on Monkey Filter looked up all my vitals and put a lot of effort into this. BB is gone. Well, problem solved. :-(
• And I am GONE from here.
• I hate to flame, JJ, but enough is enough. Cut the shit already. I get the feeling you're making most of this up. If I'm wrong, I'm sorry, but the bullshit klaxon is blaring loudly.
• Not too surprising that this happened. If it had been a child who had suffered broken bones following alcohol abuse by the guardian, there would've been an arrest as well, in all probability. Given the fact that there are lots of animal lovers at MoFi, this result was almost inevitable. And broken bones can leave an animal open to serious life-threatening infection; they should not be treated by the inexperienced. 'twasn't me, but I must admit the thought crossed my mind more than once, especially after the mention of drowning.
• Believe what you will, I am now trying to save his life because he is loved here and has a good time generally. The kids fucked everything up but I am learning to manage that. Well, he's only a cat, right? The kittens will be gone in a week and everything should get back to normal... The fight was wicked. I separated them and in doing so I threw him. If you doubt this situation, Koko, call Bruce at the Ottawa Humane Society (613) 725-3166 ext 232 and ask him about it.
• Wow. This doesn't seem right to me. I had the impression that if it was Jerry Junior who injured BB, he had done so while trying to seperate the two cats. I didn't have the impression that he had done anything malicious, or even negligent. He seemed to be doing fine—quite well, really—with all these kittens, and they were only days from all being placed. Until this problem between the adults. I don't know how that's his fault. Is there any good reason to assume that the adult cats won't get along again? All in all, I have a very bad view of whomever here called the Humane Society on JJ.
• It's not broken. It's an abcess from a bite. I can pick him up and it will cost me $80. YAY!
• What the hell?! Is this for real or not? I have been following this thread with a mixture of sympathy, admiration, trepidation, and doubt. I will agree that the histrionics were beyond believable, and I'm sort of in Koko's camp now. However, if this is true, what an utterly shitty thing to do to Jerry Junior. It seemed like he was finally getting a grip on the situation.
• On preview, glad to hear that JJ.
• Let's say someone from MoFi did call the Humane Society. I'm not at all sure that was a bad idea. It was pretty clear for a while that the situation was out of control, and that an animal was hurt and potentially others could get hurt. All the Humane Society would do is appraise the situation, and take action if necessary. Better safe than sorry. Personally, I think it was an admirable thing to do, and would have done the same if I'd had the resources. I don't think it's malicious at all.
• JJ - assuming that this isn't cat fan-fic - the next thing you need to do is get your animals spayed/neutered. I suggest you start with BB - "fixing" a male isn't as expensive as the female surgery. Once he loses the tom-cat musky scent, the female may like him a lot better. The female probably won't come into heat for a few months, so you could defer spaying her for a while. At least in my part of the US, the Humane Society or SPCA has cheap clinics for neutering and giving shots. But, I'm surprised that the Humane Society picked him up. Again, in the US, they wouldn't have to authority - it would have to be Animal Control (dogcatcher.)
• Those abscesses from cat bites are horrific. My cat had an angry exchange with another cat, but I didn't realize she had been bitten. In days she got weaker and weaker, and one day I picked her up and pus just flooded from her side. I rushed her to the vet, who didn't think she would make it. They cut open her side and basically scrubbed her out. Then I had to give her antibiotics for a week or so. Very hairy.
• Here's the poop: BB is currently in the custody of the Ottawa Humane Society and has had $80 worth of hospitality and/or drugs. (They won't tell me which but at least he has had a scary vacation AND HE IS ALIVE). I think some Monkey dropped the dime and I will be the first one to say that's OK given what I wrote. I really did think I had broken his leg and it made me think thrice (as ever). I felt awful and had spent two days as his nursemaid. Turns out he just got bit, hard. By his sister (mother of his kids... ewww, I know.) Who knew an abcess could, er, abcess that quick. Here's the story board: - JJ drinkin' and postin' - Kittens (5) runnin' 'round - Single kitten violates daddy (BB) space - BB smacks kitty gently (he is, er, was always gentle) - Kitten hisses at BB (that's my guess) *ALL HELL BREAKS LOOSE* - Momma attacks BB. - JJ tries to separate Momma and BB and is rebuffed and gets cut - Momma attacks BB again - JJ tries to separate Momma and BB and is rebuffed and gets cut - JJ grabs them by the scruff of the neck and separates them forcibly (i.e throws them away from each other) *HUMANE SOCIETY* - Momma and kittens get free reign. - JJ calls and acertainls BBs life. - JJ plans to collect BB at the Humane Society tommorrow afternoon when he has transportation. THE END
• path BB is neutered, but between the time of his shots and getting his balls cut off he knocked her up. Hence the kittens. He has beed actively disinterested since, but maternal defenses are hyperactive, I think.
• JJ, my condolences. Thanks for understanding why someone had to call the Humane Society (wasn't me, but if I had the internet-fu, I might have). Glad that BB is getting treated, even though it means a big hole in your pocket. Probably a good idea to keep mom and dad (sis and bro?) separated till the kittens are out of the way. You're absolutely right, cat maternal instincts are way high. Don't worry about freaking out over getting scratched. I got scratched a few times by cats hard enough that I bled profusely and the scars lasted almost two years.
• Let's say someone from MoFi did call the Humane Society. I'm not at all sure that was a bad idea. It was a good idea. It was an incredibly violent night. I probably would have called the ASPCA on myself if I'd had time. I think some one here did, and they did the right thing. He got the diagnosis and I am getting him back. It's all for the good. :-)
• I'm glad that's over. Now let's all have pie.
• Apple!
• Just to be really clear here: I thought he had a broken leg and if they hadn't arrested him I never would have know it was just an abcess. And if I hadn't got on the horn he would be dead. So there you go!
• At least ye weren't evicted, Jerry -- it does sound like lively times in that apartment of yours! Be sure to keep an eye on mama cat -- possible she got hurt and isn't showing signs yet. They are quick little animals when they want to be. PLease keep updating us on cat doings, and take care of yourself, too.
• Jerry, in the future, if there are cat fights, a more effective way to seperate them is to have a spray bottle, or watergun, or anything else that will let you shoot a fairly small, controlled stream of water. Believe me, spray water on the cats, they will run from it, giving you time to corral them into seperate accomodations without getting yourself scratched or having to hurl any felines across the room. If you use a spray bottle that had some sort of cleaning product or other chemical in it that could be potentially harmful if it gets in the eyes or licked up when the cat tries to clean its coat, make sure that you wash it out thoroughly so there is no chemical residue left.
• Thought for those who love runts (speaking from first-hand experience here): They often don't stay runts. When I adopted Tommy eleven years ago come July, he could sit on the palm of my hand, and he was so weak he had to sit, because he couldn't stand up. Now he still sits on the palm of my hand (UMPH!), but he weighs in at around 20 pounds, and several friends have suggested that I might have a home-grown, accidental Desert Lynx on my hands. His mama was just a little tabby lady, so the wild side must have come from his daddy. I wish I could have met him; he must have been quite a piece of work.
• Thanks for your advice, Christophine. I should have had one on hand and then BB might be fine and I likely wouldn't have this multitude of scratches on my hands and wrists and the local Humane Society crawling up my ass. But maybe she bit him and caused his injury in the first attack. Not a lot I could have done about that. Note to the internet detective: I had a vet who would have helped me the very next day, for free. I am resourceful that way, and I love my cats. I understand why you did what you did but I am frustrated: I could have had free treatment and follow-up and now I am on the hook for $300 and on record as--at the very least--an uncaring pet owner. That couldn't be farther from the truth. So I have had to pawn my instrument to avoid the law crashing down on me. Perhaps hold off and write an e-mail next time? Even a threatening email: "I will call The ***** Humane Society unless you take him in..." Or not. Regardless, I no longer have a meaningful profile here on MoFi and I encourage others to not be so open with your name and information as I was. As it stands BB has been treated and I continue his treatment and mom and pop are segregated until the kittens are adopted. Then I will reintroduce the parents and see how it goes. When I can afford to have her fixed I will. The "technician" at the Humane Society speculated that she may have gone into heat again already (fecund SOBs the felines!) and that's why she attacked him at the drop of a paw. He had been very gentle with the kittens for the most part so far (I only ever saw him swipe one away when it bit him on his non-existant balls) so I have to beleive it was something like that. Maybe a kitten hissed at him and that was all it took. I want to stress to anybody skimming this insane thread that I separated them pretty violently (and now have a hyper-focused water sprayer: the RPG of all pet-control devices) but it was the momma cat's well placed bites to the poppa cat's foreleg that resulted in this shitty situation. I thought that I might hav broken his leg when I tossed him but I should have known better. He landed right but he was already the victim of her bite. LaGatta: indeed the runt of this litter has great potential. Of the five kittens she is the quickest on her feet and the first to try anything. I just walked outside to check on some yelling (I live in an, er, active neighbourhood) and before I could close the door the runt was standing there beside me on the porch. I could swear there was no kitten within ten feet of me when I opened the door. She is also the most relaxed and least fearful. She'll make an excellent pet for whoever adopts her.
• JJ: You wouldn't consider keeping her? Sounds like you have a kitty that teleports, like my Nefret Jane. I swear I've chased all the cats out of the study and closed the door, and five minutes later, she's meowing to be let out...
• LaGatta, no, at this point I have enough trouble with seven. But I would rather keep her than her mother. Her mother is a whiner whereas she is just perfectly happy, just like her dad. But you can't pick your kids and as a grandparent you better be careful picking favourites. No one can tell what a child will be like as an adult but this one is a keeper for sure. And I bet she'd get along with her dad. I have been thinking about keeping the runt but if I do I have to find a new home for the momma cat. I might try. I do like "Napoleaon" as she was named higher in this thread. She is incredibly smart and supple and durable. Awesome cat.
• BTW: a great kitten toy - a straw broom. They are attacking it en masse. Straws are great, but a straw broom is bigger.
• Many kittens also like a rolled-up ball of aluminum foil. The little skittery sounds it makes, especially on linoleum, tile, or wood floors seems very attractive to most kittens I've known.
• Meh. I love you bees. :-)))
• Indeed, Christophine, the tin-foil ball is an ultimate weapon off perfect distraction and it works. All is quiet here. I have to go designate sleeping spaces. Thanks, all.
• <3s Jerry Junior.
• Pens and plastic rings off milk bottles. Pens on wooden/linoleum floors slide around well. I couldn't write at all if my cat was in the same room as me.
• Laser pointer!!! (keep away from kitty eyes, of course) I found out yesterday that ceiling spiders will chase laser pointer dot, too - fun!
• Fish tick, you have way too much time on your hands (and maybe live in a srange spider-infested place)
• sure it's not the DTs, fish tick? ;)
• Oy! One ceiling spider does not an infestation make. Koko, I'll have to try it again ASAP before the OD to KO the DT theory.
• Can I just point out that I mentioned laser pointers first? :-P
• Well, kitten, I'm not to be fooled by ears still wilted at the tips and jeweled stare and spiky tail -- I know soon those tiny hisses that sound so like a match being struck -- all such infant kitten blisses mean this sucker's out of luck.
• A length of twine seems to work amazingly well. They fight the ends and each other at the same time (tug-o-war). The ensuing fraying only makes it more fun!
• This is awesome: the runt is trying to kill and old pair of stinky jeans. All is well with the world in her mind at least.
• Such fun to kick and bite this denim. As long as Jerry isn't wearin' 'em!
• So I'm now in kitten adoption mode, if only temporarily. This happens once or twice a year - I think it's from the same human family, who seem to raise the cats to a certain point, then kick them out. They're well socialized, and love to be petted, and seem to know that this house is where to come for succor. The previous 2,which I'm sure were half siblings, were a female, which we managed to give to a women who adored her, and a male (which I had neutered, who's a bit feral, but is trying to find a way to be an inside cat. But the latest is so sad. Looks enough like the previous 2 that she has to be a half sister, but the humans kicked her out at a much younger age. Can't be more than 3 months old. When we found her, she was somewhere in the carriage of our car, yelling in that baby voice that any cat raisers will recognise. We managed to catch her, and she was extremely thin and had serious eye infections (lots of pus welling up), ear mites and an upper respiratory infection. She's living in my bathroom, at this point, and is feeling enough better that she'd really like to go explore, but until I know that her respiratory infection is under control, I can't let her meet my ashtmatic cat, since it could be deadly for him if he caught it. I've washed my hands so many timea to ensure that I didn't transfer germs that I need some serious dry skin help. So,now, I'll have to get her healthy and give her away, if I can. Shame on whoever let her be born without caring about her.
• Bless you Path.
• Oh, path, that's heartbreaking. You're an angel. Better buy some dry-skin lotion for your hands. I use one brand called Rosken, but it's from Australia/New Zealand, so I'm not sure if you can find it. Look for those that help seal moisture, so that subsequent washings don't dry your skin out as much.
• The new kitten is a darling. She loves to cuddle. I'm so glad that my insomnia was acting up and I heard her crying from under the car. Thanks to the trip to the vet, lots of antibiotics, and plenty of Science Diet kitten food, she is well on the mend. She's put on some meat, so we don't feel her ribs sticking out through her fur anymore. She has stopped the sneezing from the respiratory infection, so it's nearly gone. There's no more pus coming from her eyes, and the swelling has gone down enough that she can finally open them completely. I'm telling you, I'd love to find the people who let her feel safe, loved, and cared for, and then threw her away when they decided she was too old for them to want anymore. Find them, and kick them in the head. Repeatedly.
• Supplementary zinc in her diet might not hurt along about now. And a few drops of fish oil once or twice a week. Can we see a picture of the new kitty? I would enjoy seeing some of Jerry's ensemble, too.
• That's good of you to take them in, but how do you tell an abandoned cat from a lost one? When my cat was a few years old, she went missing for two weeks outside. She was terribly missed, but we looked everywhere. I don't know if we hung signs (too many feral cats around), but we called the humane society - no one brought her in. Finally, my aunt who lived at the other end of the building heard a cat who sounded like her. It turned out she had gotten truly lost, and thought my aunt's balcony was ours (both groundfloor), and couldn't understand why we weren't there (she didn't know my aunt well). I guess that just made me very aware of how easily cats can become lost, and their families can't find them. If my aunt hadn't recognised her calling, we might never have gotten my cat back. And when we got her back, she looked awful. Of course, she then lived to 18. She didn't go far away again.
• BB is limping around healthily. The abcess became a scab a few days ago and there is no more swelling and shortly thereafter he started scratching with both paws and now he is using his right leg to get around, albeit gingerly. He is healing and seems to have time to chase insects who fly nine feet off the ground. Good for him. He is still very tolerant with the kittens when I grant visiting rights. As per the law I have to take him into the vet tomorrow so they can stick a thermometre up his ass and declare him healthy (another $100 thank you very much!). I have to make sure that he is in "general good health" and that his wound is healing. No problem and I am happy. I thought it was I that had hurt him. Turns out he hurt her too, it just didn't get infected or crippling. Remind me not to get into another cat fight. Wicked stuff when played out online. I suspect he is a bit of a malingerer as has made six foot leaps (I've seen him do it) a few days ago. But I am very happy to see him putting weight on his--wait a minute--right front carpus. He's very mobile and as fond of my students' guitar cases as ever... He doesn't like taking pills and I can't blame him but if they tell me to force the dope in forever (they gave me 40-days worth) I will. Or not. I think I'll have pics of the kittens tommorrow night. I need a few pics and they are soon on their way.
• Realistically you should get any cat bite looked at (when a cat bites another cat, I mean). They're not as hygienic as they seem, and it takes next to nothing for a bite or scratch to abcess. Our old half-feral cat from when I was a kid would get into fights constantly and he seemed to have an abcess a week. You may have to look into that pet health insurance, Jerry. :)
• jb - I might have thought she was lost, but we've had three strays come here in the last year and who said "I want to live here." They seemed to have no incentive to find their old home. They have very similar facial and body characteristics, and show some signs of abuse. The newest one is much younger than the previous 2, so it's a lot harder to triage, but there have been no posters or ads in the paper asking for her. The latest, named Extra, was very frightened of human contact, but we've gotten through that. The one before, Spot, was older when he became a stray, and is much less able to accept that he's welcome. Our two oldest, and very spoiled, cats, which were also street cats when we got them, are tired of us adding more felines to our family. These new additions are causing some agita. Extra may be placeable elsewhere, but Spot - well, probably not.
• Great BB's on the mend! Looking forward to pictures of your kangaroo-cat, Jerry!
• :-) Thanks bees.
• Realistically you should get any cat bite looked at I have learned that lesson and I shall never forget it. I never suspected it and igonored good advice early on in this thread. You may have to look into that pet health insurance, Jerry. :) Don't think I haven't thought of it every waking moment for the last week! I suppose this is what a medical emergency feels like... But I think when the kittens are gone (making progress there) momma and poppa will re-harmonize. They are OK together now but I don't leave them together when I am not in the room (I know, I know). I think it was a singularity. I sure hope so. I am still counting the lessons I have learned in this experience.
• I can't figure out the digital camera "flash" card. All is well with the world feline and otherwise.
• /THE END
• 2/3 have happy homes!
• The remnants are as ... as usual. :-(
• Oh, excellent! -- and wish ye well in placing the rest. Trust BB's leg is fairly well healed by now?
• Totally healed and mellow as ever, bees. But Squeak seems to be going a bit mad again (in heat?) so I have to keep a very close eye on them and segregate them when I am sleeping/out. Poor guy. From what I can see he does nothing wrong, just plays with the kittens like a good gentle dad, but she is stressed to say the least. Always squeaking. We're all happy when she takes a cat nap. The 2/3 happy homes fell through. :-( Shouldn't count my kittens 'fore they are launched. But I am doing a mass mailing to friends/family/colleagues tonight including a link to some crappy pics I took today. I have faith that I will find homes for them soon. They are great babies with interesting personalities. And I've got a 22 lb. bag of litter and several pounds of food so we should be OK for a few days more anyway.
• Handsome little cats! -- and they will never be easier to find homes for than they are now. Good luck, Jerry!
• Ah, man! If I didn't already have too many cats, I'd take Napoleon in a sec. Have you put an ad in the paper? It's been a long time since I had kittens to give away, but back then a "free kitten" ad would have them placed in very quickly.
• Napolean (named by Alnedra?) is a most extraordinary little cat. The littlest of the bunch but by far the most courageous and vocal. She never stops talking! This kitten NEVER STOPS ANYTHING. Intense. Mad cat. If I open any door--internal or external--the runt is through it. At speed. This cat is crazy and careless. If I wasn't fast on my feet she would have been a grease spot on the road the other day. Curiosity will DEFINE this cat. Like I said, crazy. Great pet! I'm holding off on the paper as it costs $40 and I want to find homes within my circle if I can. But at a point reality intrudes. I have at least two more weeks. There is something to be said for living with seven others in the mean time... I just have learn.
• My cat died just after Christmas and I've looked at kitten listings a few times since then. Anyway, I was surprised to see that the newspaper here (Albuquerque) in its classifieds says:

  NOTICE Animal Control Ordinance states "An owner shall not advertise, sell, barter, exchange or give away any dog or cat uless the litter fee or hobby breeder permit number is displayed legibly." Effective January 6, 2004, the Albuquerque Publishing Company will request the permit number to be published in all dog or cat advertisements. Please make a note of this and direct all questions to the Animal Control Centers in your community.

  There's almost no pet ads--there's only two for "cats: crossbreed", and neither show a permit number. (Pop. of metro area is about 650K.) So I'm guessing that the advertisers proved they were out of the city limits or something. All the local shelters have many listings, but it looks to me like this ordinance has all but eliminated the p2p classified ad pet giveaway trade. Which seems unfortunate to me. Any other communities doing this? Can anyone explain to me what's going on here?
• It certainly is illegal to sell pets on the side of the road or via the classified ads in your town, kmellis. I guess you simply need a license to deal in pets. It is indeed unfortunate as it is likely to be an attempt to avoid such tragedies as puppy mills but it likely also prevents people with limited means from finding homes for unwanted pets. I am sure there is a similar by-law here in Ottawa, but it doesn't seem to appy to newspaper ads. Sorry to hear about your cat. :-(
• Thanks, JJ. I'm still missing her and its been six months. But she was with me for 14 years, so I guess I'll miss her for awhile. I don't know what is behind that ordinance. It was a surprise to go to the classifieds to look for a kitten/cat to adopt and find almost nothing there.
• It kind of looked to me as though the city was requiring a litter fee before individuals could advertise to give away, sell, etc., animals. Maybe the idea was to provide income for the city, or to strengthen adherence to spay/neuter rules, but it seems to me to just make sure people with litters will have no choice but to kick out unwanted pets if they couldn't afford the fee. I wonder if you have to pay the fee before your animal becomes pregnant. On the other hand, maybe there's an underground for those who want to place pets without paying a fee? And if you give an animal to a friend, should they turn you in. Are adult animals you can't take with you to a new residence exempt if they weren't from litters you raised. I tried to check out Albuquerque ordinances, but the site was so slow loading that I gave up. On the other hand, the quote from your newspaper said "check with Animal Control." Maybe you should call them. There are a lot questions I'd like to hear the answers to. In the meantime, the kitten we found with all the problems is really thriving. She's a speed demon, curious about everything, talkative, and loves to carry whatever she can find around here in her mouth - not just the toys we bought her, but coins, paperclips, and whatever else she can fish out of my purse. And, she loves to cuddle. If I were in easy driving distance from you I'd suggest you might want to take her on as a solace for your loss.
• That is an interesting cat, Path. What's her name?
• Her name is Extra.
• Hmmmm, with Path's soft heart, I can see a whole caboodle of Extras. Extra 1 Extra 2 Extra 3 Extra etc. oh, and Spare 1 Spare 2...
• Well, the name "Extra" has some history in our family. Way back when, maybe 40 years ago, my younger brother adopted a female tortoise-shell kitten with a similar coat of pale orange, gray, a bit of black and white, who looked a lot like this cat. He got the name from a local rancher whom he knew and who had a cat of that name. I named this one in hopes that he'd take her on, since he'd said that he wanted a kitten. But, his wife said "no." But, yeah, we've taken in 5 stray cats in the last 5 years. The first, a Manx, walked in and said "I'm going to live here", but had enough charm that we said "ok." Since then, we've had lots of animals who've wanted to live here - game chickens, rabbits, even an iguana, which we've either been able to ignore (while providing food) or give to someone else. But the cats just keep coming. A couple of years ago, a very sweet female adolescent moved in, and we were able to place her with a friend. A while later, a male tabby who was starving said "Please feed me" and we did and still do. He loves to be petted, but is still half feral. Extra is the youngest of the parade of cats, so far, but I suspect that she's related to at least the previous 2, based on physical makeup. The others who've shown up were mostly too old to be adoptable. So, what are we supposed to do? I did ignore a cat who haunted our place since he seemed too tomcat old to be tamable, but he got squished by a car in front of our house. We have more than enough cats, but leaving new applicant to starvation or worse doesn't seem an option. And, if you're going to say "call animal control", well my county is full of scandals about how those folks handle the problem. And the closest ASPCA is 30 miles away. This is a rural area, and the ranchers I've talked to support lots of cats who've been tossed off at their doors -like 20 or more. Some of them get the guests spayed or neutered, and really care about keeping them healty. Others don't. So, yes, I think that 1 or more young cats will show up on our doorstep next year. We've got more cats now than we ever wanted, but how do you say "no" to a terrified kitten with horrible conjunctivitis, ear mite investation, starving...? Am I too soft? If so, what should I do to change?
• Path - you're a Good Monkey. Bless ye.
• Path: Cat Magnet. I grew up on a farm that was just off a popular rural road frequented by cottagers from the city. Without fail around Labour Day weekend we would have abandoned pets - cats, dogs, no iguanas unfortunately! - showing up on our porch looking for home. So sad that people would get a pet just for the summer and then drop it off. We would see the cars stop at the end of the lane and the door open and close and know that some animal had just been abandoned. I think we had more than 20 cats and about five dogs at the end of any given cottage season. Most of the cats learned to rat around in the granaries and the dogs just filled up the house.
• Ah, JJ, very sad. And, worse than mine, since I seem to get a couple of stray cats from a particular family periodically, and yours were many more animals from a lot of families. I have to wonder how those people explained the drop offs to their children. I'n not the magnet. As I've pointed out, lots of animals pick the place I live in for a home. (Except we've had no dogs, not sure why.) I guess my part is socializing the cats. But, look, y'all, my real point is that there are people out there who let this stuff happen. I have no idea what to do about it, but it seems there should be something. I think we smart monkeys are in the spay and neuter clan, which helps, but we may be a minority compared to those who don't care about unwanted litters.
• I have to wonder how those people explained the drop offs to their children. I've often wondered about that. It's simply so heartless, and completely indefensible. And it was so frequent and predictable. Socializing the cats is a truly honourable and compassionate act, path, and I am with you all the way. I remember our "favourite" dropped-off dog, Annie, something like a cross between a collie and a pug. When she arrived she would not go near any man. Male presences (stature, voice, etc.) obviously terrified her. A raised hand (by either sex) had her cringing. She never quite got totally comfortable with men but in the 12 years she lived with us she got a lot of joy and fun and she was just the sweetest dog you can imagine. I myself cringe at the tought of what she must have experienced in her previous home. There is indeed evil in the world. Even where I live now--in the heart of a city--I still see abandoned animals scavenging. I like to think there is some good reason but mostly it just makes me angry. Then again, I get to see a lot of abandoned people, too.
• Jesus. The biggest kitten is twice as big as the smallest one. Wow.