March 28, 2005

• I know it is against the rules to self-post, but I saw this too and moreover, last year I saw a flyer for a Halo party put on by the campus Christian Student Fellowship. However, unlike the "How to witness with Halo 2," it wasn't obvious that this was related to a religous group as it only said, "CSF House" (However, one would have to know what "CSF" meant to find the house, I suppose). I didn't go so I don't know if this was really a ploy to convert gamers, or if it was simply an event that just happened to be organized by the Christian Student Fellowship.
• Holy WTF, Batman. This sort of thing makes me just wonder how far people will go to shove a heapin' helpin' of Jesus down the throat of anyone who will listen. And, from the Napoleon link: "Which is exactly how Jesus wanted it to be. That way He gets all the credit, especially when He comes back and the church experiences the ultimate Revenge of the Nerds." Which made me immediately picture Jesus all jamming out on his electric violin. Poindexter Christ. Because it is soooo cool nowadays to have been a nerd in high school, even Jesus is jumping on the bandwagon. And let me tell you, being a nerd or a geek in high school wasn't cool at the time. Believe me.
• CLF- Which is what I was trying to get at, trying to figure out how wide the gyre has to be before the center will not hold. At what point as Debbie Does Dallas going to be used to witness? (And how much of this is just backdooring secular things that would otherwise be condemned by the church orthodoxies? Like, I can't really see Halo being incorporated into a particularly sophisticated view of Christian dogma, but perhaps that's just me...) I also found their Red Lake stuff pretty macabre. But hey, if you believe it's your mission...
• The Halo 2 thing was pretty lame. The story of an end-of-the-world battle with an ultimate evil is so common that it's really a stretch to apply it to the bible. Last I checked, in renouncing Satan, Jesus did not say "take up thy pulse rifle and blast alien scum". On the other hand, the Napoleon Dynamite one was kinda cool. That movie is all about redemption and "the meek inheriting the earth". With the movie's Mormon roots, I expect some biblical narratives to creep in. On preview: Yeah, Christianity is not supposed to be "cool", it's supposed to be "right", just like Napoleon Dynamite.
• Hey now, no Yeats quotes unless you've actually muddled through The Vision and can explain in detail what a 'gyre' is.
• I believe it was Pope Sergius III who had all references to Napoleon Dynamite removed from the Bible.
• Dude, young christians crave edgy, confrontive stuff. I've seen christian tattoos on kids. And if someone starts witnessing for you in Halo 2, during gameplay, can you just kill them in the game? Would that be rude or fun or both?
• MonkeyFilter: If you had what you believed to be the truth about everlasting paradise, wouldn't you be remiss not to make every effort to share it? MonkeyFilter: Holy WTF, Batman. MonkeyFilter: even Jesus is jumping on the bandwagon And that's MY final take on your religion
• Wow, Christians trying to co-opt pop culture?? Shocking! Next you'll be telling me there are "Christian rock bands!"
• What a great way to increase your market share. S0ny presents "How to witness with Halo 2 Toolkit" (or everquest, 1942, and on and on.) retrosurf, both but more fun.
• OMG! WTF dude? Halo 2 is available on Xboxen which is by Micro$oft not $ony! ROFLMAO!!! next thing you'll be telling me how the DS has better games than the PSP!!! LOL!!!
• Dr. Jimmy- But at what point does Christian cooption of secular culture compromise the central tenets of the religion? Or perhaps you'd be happier just snarking about this.
• what part of modern christianity hasn't already compromised the central tenets of the historical and spiritual jesus? There is no room for speculative contemplation (or con-templar or what we should be doing in church and temple) in the modern church. Basically you have a man dressed in a judges robe (or something similar) presiding over the design of a modern secular court room (or of the court of a king). and 52 sundays a year, this man plays both advocate and judge of the 'pulpit bible' by saying the Gospel (which is supposed to be good news) claims that we are all sinners and can't be good. . . BUT 'we should be good'. So, we get 52 sermans of 'be good' and then everybody sings some religious nursery rhymes. Where do you think Britney learned to rock tha house? Christianity is, at present, more 'pop culture' than napoleon dynamite will ever be. And the scary part is, just like britney, christianity takes itself seriously.
• at what point does their conception of Christianity have to become a similacra If we are referring to the Baudrillardian simulacrum, the question as posed makes no sense. It is always already a simulacrum.
• Many years ago one of my sons played Dungeons and Dragons (and yes, I do still tease him about it), and some local christian meddlers tried to give him and his friends trouble about it. When that didn't work, they tried to co-opt the games: "Jesus is the only DM you'll ever need!" When that didn't work, they got pissy about it and tried to raise a huge fuss in their busybody church to ban the 'Satanic nightmare'. When that didn't work, they called the media (who didn't care at all). When that didn't work, they were all crabby for a while longer, until some new Terrible Threat To The Souls Of Mankind popped up. I think it was cabbage patch kids or nicotine gum, but it's hard to keep all of these so very imminent and dangerous psychic toxins straight. Wait one week, maybe two. By that time, the busybodies will have a new bugbear and all of the game players can go back to having fun without being bothered by these creeps.
• Erm what game isn't about aliens attacking the earth and a single figure rescuing everyone?? At least Doom includes a healthy dose of pentagrams and goat skulls.
• "Jesus is the only DM you'll ever need!" I would so play a game of, like, the armies of hell vs. the armies of heaven. y'know? It would be badass. I know I'm missing the point. I don't know. I don't have a problem with people seeing life through a particular lens. That's their right. And I don't even mind drawing parallels or metaphors in order to illustrate their point to others. But I do feel uncomfortable with co-opting everything to the point where a) they refuse to engage in anything that's not explicitly about their religion or b) they don't understand that their religion is not, actually, What Absolutely Everything Is About. I had an uncomfortable moment talking online with some teenage/college-age people who insisted that the TV series we were talking about at the time HAD to be explicitly Christian, because the protagonist didn't like to kill people. That bothers me. The inference, of course, is that nobody but Christians have those morals, so naturally, if the hero is humane, he has to be Christian. I'm not even angry about it so much as bothered that they really think that. I feel sorry for them, almost. So that insistence that everything good comes from their worldview, that I find a problem. Dorky swiping of pop culture in order to make themselves look "cool," I don't think works so well. At least not on reasonably savvy kids. I can't take it that seriously - it comes off like someone's dad trying desperately to talk kid lingo. And like that metaphorical dad, they would probably be much better off, if they want to proselytize (that's one of the words I can't spell, so moving on), they would be much better off getting to the point in normal language and making themselves seem relevant, rather than grabbing some superficial trappings as camouflage. You want to turn kids on to Jesus? Okay, make them see how this would be a good thing in their lives. Tell them what you stand for. Make them think, and some may decide that you have a good system going. Catchphrases and pop ephemera are not going to do this. But then, I'm thinking more along the lines of sincerely exchanging ideas and not just cramming people into pews, so y'know.
• Wurwilf, I have Christian friends and neighbours who believe that religion is the only moral compass a person can have, and that without it there is nothing stopping someone from a sociopathic lifestyle. I'm very glad that they are Christians.
• The main character, Master Chief, is called "the Demon" by all the religious types. It's the religious types that are about to destroy the universe, and it's due to their unwillingness to listen to science. They'd rather destroy the universe than re-examine their religious beliefs. I don't think Halo 2 is the best game to witness someone with.
• Can I get a witness? MonkeyFilter: They'd rather destroy the universe ...
• Mr. K: Yeah, but see, those religious types are Catholics, not good Evangelicals. (Kidding). Wolof: Christianity only exists as a simulacrum if there is no truth to Christianity. "The simulacrum is never that which conceals the truth--it is the truth which conceals that there is none." The question was at what point the trappings of Christian culture so distort Christian belief that there is no inherent truth left.
• Inherent truth? Christianity?
• Nor is the quote "truly" from Ecclesiastes.
• Wurwilf - I'm pretty sure there is a game where you play Heaven vs Hell. I think my friend DM'd one. You get to pick what kind of demon or angel you are.
• I told Jesus that he souldn't try to take the flag by himself. That he, as the Son of God should stay safe at our home base and don't sacrifice himself for the team. But he refused and said that the destiny of the lamb of God is to get owned... ...sucker. >:)
• metafilter: the destiny of the lamb of God is to get owned. Sucker!
• keyboard in mouth award goes to me. Monkeyfilter. Monkeyfilter. Monkeyfilter. Hear no evil. See no evil. Type no evil.
• Witnessing Buddhism--See, everytime I frag somebody and they respawn they're a step closer to Nirvana. Eventually, if they've been very good in their past life, they stop respawning and start owning. Owning is the path to the end game where all are as one. Witnessing Nietzsche--It's Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence, wrapped into a nightmare package of getting a plasma sword shoved through your head again and again. The path of ownage leads to the Ubermensch. Witnessing ????--Hey look! If we all jump on top of each other we can make a column that goes outside the level. All we have to do is avoid shooting each other in the foot in our quest for freedom. Co-operation leads to escaping the box of perceptions which The Designers have forced us into. (Maybe Dadaism, Surrealism or Erisianism. Or something else. Take your pick.)
• Situationism would work there, Pez.
• Wolof- Even setting aside the argument over the godhead of Christ (in which I do not believe) there are inherent truths contained in Christianity (like that adherence to laws is not the same as piety). If I felt that you weren't just being a prick, I might feel like engaging you more. Maybe you should wait until you have something to add before commenting again. And I didn't cite Ecclisiastes, now did I? Pez- Communism is the easiest fit for that last one, I think... Copper- Not sure where you get the Situationists out of that...
• js: Pez wrote this -- "Co-operation leads to escaping the box of perceptions....", which tallies nicely with soem Situationist-think.
• Copper: Yeah, I can see that, what with the perceptions. I think it'd make a good poster slogan, and to me, that's what the Sits were all about.
• NPCs getting stuck in non-opened doors which you can't open would have to rate some kind of philosophical/theological discussion. Limbo, existentialism, etc.
• You know, js, when you call people "stupid", "prick", "pro-TV whiner", (and all the rest), there is some chance that this will come back to dog you.