February 03, 2005

• Sorry about the [more inside] doubling... I'm new at this.
• Only 15? Good lord. I tried some googling, which I'm sure you have as well. What I found was very medical-ese. On the other hand, my daughter has little memory of her childhood, and it seems to stem from having faced things she didn't want to remember. A few things started peeking through when she was 30 or so, but the progress is slow. Was the treatment for your neuroblastoma painful, or maybe frightening? Or, were you old enough to realize that you might die from it? Those seen to me to be things one might want to forget. If you really want to delve into the past at this point, can you get stories from your family? On the other hand, if you can asssume that things will come to the surface when you're older, maybe it would be better to wait till then to write a biography. And, a novel! Be sure to keep us updated on that.
• One thing that can jolt one's memory is smell. Do you remember a certain meal, recipe, perfume, soap, from the time you want to recall? Especially soap - whether it be for dishes or clothes or furniture.
• Instead of trying to remember your childhood as some sort of narrative, just capture one random memory at a time. If you have a recollection, no matter how brief, write down everything that you remember about it. Often, exploring that one little snippet will open the door to other memories. You don't need the exact context or time of the memory. Just write it as it comes. As you get more down on paper, it will be easier to start piecing things together, maybe with the help of your friends and family.
• I'm 20, and just started remembering things from before I was about 14 a year or maybe two ago. There's still a whole lot I don't remember, though. It's definitely associated with things I don't want to remember, my life has been cut into pretty definite segments like that. But all through high school I couldn't remember anything and it really bothered me that I couldn't even really remember middle school... So when I started remembering things I used to tell them to whoever I was with at the time, or write them down, just so maybe I wouldn't forget them again. But I'd venture a guess that you've a good chance of remembering more as time goes by. I don't have anything useful to suggest as to how to find lost memories, though, unfortunately. on preview, as kimdog says, it does seem to be a lot easier to remember random moments than a coherent event.
• path: Of course it was painful, it was painful as all hell, and frightening too. I really want to remember, though, I'm not afraid of it, I'm much more afraid of the fact that I won't be able to remember any of the things I went through; if not for my own good, then to be able to relate them for the benefit of others, y'know? I'm still pretty close with a lot of my doctors, nurses, and volunteers from the hospital, so I've been getting in touch with them and having them relate stories, which is helpful in more ways than one. It's not just my memories about my treatment that are fuzzy/nonexistent, it's almost everything. It's not only before a certain point, either. It's like an advancing haze, if you will, and I can't remember clearly more than a few months back at any given time. I started saving momentos from things I've done (ticket stubs, notes, etc)in the hopes that they'll keep from forgetting things, and it does seem to help. Thanks for your interest in the novel, too. For future reference, where would the best place be to keep you monkeys updated? goofyfoot: Some smells do help greatly, the smell of alcohol wipes, for instance. I should probably look into this type of thing some more, though. Thanks for reminding me. Just to point out something I didn't before: I can remember facts and sort of what happened, but I can't really remember being there. That'd be okay, I guess, but I don't want to just regurgitate the facts of my life, I want to share the experience. Also, I'll remember some events really vividly, just like little scenes from my life, so I've tried to just make little, short, seperate stories out of those. (If anyone's interested in looking at some of these, feel free to e-mail me) The amount of these are growing, but I feel like there's got to be some easier way, some way to fill in all the holes. On preview, kimdog: Great minds think alike, huh? Thanks.
• One important thing to remember, which I think was touched on in the previous thread: memory is a vast associative network. The more associations you tap, the more likely you are to remember some old, out of the way memory. That's why we have the experience of seeing an old photograph and having all sorts of memories flood back - the memories aren't gone, you just haven't accessed them because they are so far removed. As an artist/art student, my work has been exploring my obsession with memory, but I've also taken some psych classes on the subject to stay abreast of the more scientific side of the issue. One of the popular theories floating around right now is that very little memory loss is due to a sort of general decay, the way we think of a photograph fading. Rather, it's an issue of interference - the information is there, but there are stronger associative bonds with other parts of memory, so the probability of those particular memories being accessed is quite low. This would make sense on an evolutionary level - the more we need certain information, the stronger the associative link becomes, the more likely you are to remember that information. This is also why in the previous thread people were talking about "storing" memories in people and objects. What's really happening is that they're forming a strong link between that object and the desired memory/information, so that when they see the object the required information jumps into their head. The ancient Greeks, when memorizing speeches, used to walk around around a temple or a large public place. They rehearse the same lines at different points in the temple, so an association would form between that part of the speech and the specific location in the temple. Then, when they were actually giving the speech, they'd mentally walk around the temple which would help them cue up the required text. So, I guess my advice is to go look at mementos. Because of the associative nature of memory, recognition memory is much stronger than unprompted recall. Write a list of things that you do remember, trigger words, etc. - more information will start coming as you actually start putting it on paper. Find old photographs, yearbooks, etc. Go back to a childhood hang out - you'd be surprised what ends up being a cue. Woo, okay, I'm a little obsessed. Hopefully, if you just trudged through all that, you found a little useful information.
• I have the same problem. I can't remember the vast majority of my childhood. I've wondered if it's because I don't want to remember it or whether it's just that all memory works the way mine does. But people tell me the latter is untrue. So, uh, I don't know the answer, but you're not alone. For what it's worth, I try to focus on making new memories rather than trying to recall old ones.
• It sounds like you do focused writing already--by focused, I mean writing on your novel, writing current happenings, writing down the "facts" as you call them. Perhaps you should do some "free" writing centered around what a particular word means to you. Pick a word, like your name, or blue, or surgical, or Neuroblastoma, or bicycle--something, and write for five or ten minutes. Don't try to direct the writing, just let words flow. Don't push for memories, but do try to get the five senses into it as well as the emotional "feel" that you have about a word. Perhaps sentences and phrases wouldn't be what comes to you--you might feel like drawing circles with a few words inside and linking them with other circles or even making small pictures. The point is to put something on paper while being open to what comes from within. Sounds kind of weird, but it's amazing what can come out with a bit of practice--say once a day for a week. You're only talking ten minutes a day, so it shouldn't be too terrible. After you're done, put the paper away for at least a couple hours and don't think about it. Then come back to it and see if there is something there that triggers memory or association. Good luck.
• I really like Roach's suggestion to visit the places that are part of your past. When I do that in my own life, invariably I'm flooded with memories, and associated memories, and so on.... Do you or your parents still have stuff from your past in storage? Childhood crafts projects, children's books, baseball cards, whatever? Get your hands on those things, and see what happens to your memory. Look into hypnosis, too. Good luck to you. Even though I'm entering middle age, and have lost many, many childhood memories, I can only imagine how it would feel to be unable to access memories in the way that seems to be the case for you.
• I think BlueHorse's suggestion is potentially fecund.
• As people have said I think it's normal for some people not to be able to remember clear narratives. If you said to me remember a certain part of my life, it would just be fragments. I don't know how far your problem goes, but maybe it is of some comfort that not everyone remembers a book of their life anyway.
• there are some very good ideas in this thread! you may also want to look into so-called second brain in the stomach's reaction to the pain/painkillers/trauma of your health situation. There's a bit in the linked article that talks specifically about ulcerative colitis and the enteric brain. on an unrelated note, few things I've experienced in my life sucked more than a bout with colitis. it's my personal opinion that you rock for being able to do anything at all.
• hey humor, perhaps something like this would help. i gave this book, "The Story of a Lifetime," to my mother recently when she expressed interest in writing her memoirs. she's really enjoying it. maybe answering specific questions would be helpful?
• I had a wicked head injury about a year ago. Since, I've had some nasty short term memory issues and have been working with a neurology department at the local medical school. In essence, I am doing exercises that kimdog and TheRoach hit upon. Considering that your memory loss seems to be more global rather than specifically short or long term loss, you might find other tools as well that can help but "memory is a vast associative network. The more associations you tap, the more likely you are to remember some old, out of the way memory" is very true in my case. bon chance and congratulations on almost finsihing your novel
• Thanks everyone. I'm home sick with a sore throat, so I guess I've got nothing better to do than respond to everyone's comments individually. Also, just to note, I'm not really expecting to have some sort of miraculous memory recovery, but it does make a big difference just talking about it and venting. I think I'm going to make some progress in spite of myself, though, so thanks. roach: I've noticed that whole association thing, it really does help alot; that's why now, like I said before, I try and keep little momentos from whenever I do something vaguely interesting, because they help me remember a lot more than one would think. That doesn't really help with stuff that is further back than I started collecting momentos, though. This does seem to be helping, though, because I just remembered that I played through Final Fantasy 7 and read all of the Star Wars books when I was in treatment...maybe I should play/read those again? I do think that going back to some locations would really help; the only problem being that most of the hospital has been re-done since I was in treatment. Thanks, though, and a little obsession is never a bad thing, especially when it on a subject I'm interested in. :) Smo: I think that's generally a good philosphy to have, but I can't help but think that if I don't work on recalling my old memories, what's the point of making new ones? I'm just going to forget them anyways. I don't really totally beleive in that, but it is how I feel sometimes. :shrug: Thanks, none-the-less, however. I guess it's nice, in a sort of twisted way, to know that I'm not alone. Maybe some of the stuff here can help you too? Bluehorse: This seems like a great idea, I'll be sure to try it out. Thanks! HawthorneWingo: I do want to visit places that I spent a lot of time at when I was younger, but like I said before, my access to them is kind of limited. A lot of my family have moved to different houses, different apartments, we've moved a few times, etc. On top of that, up until right before I got sick, I lived in Boston, and now I live outside of NYC, and given that I can't even drive for a good 10 months, it's not really that easy for me to visit, well, much of anywhere. I guess it's a matter of waiting, but I hate waiting. It seems too similar to wasting time. Hypnosis interests me, but I don't know anything about it. Has anyone had any experience with it? Wolof: All I have to say is that I couldn't help but think you were somehow comparing BlueHorse's suggestion to feces, even though I know you weren't. Wibbleflex: Indeed. That poses another problem, one that seems almost impossible to answer: how much and how well do people normally remember? patita: The link diddn't work, but google-fu brought me to this. Whether that was what you meant to share or not, thanks. Now I've got something to keep me occupied for at least a little while. SideDish Yeah, that looks interesting, thanks. Well, thanks everyone for all the advice and good wishes. It makes me feel all warm inside. :) On preview, I wrote way too much. Also, thank you Johnn, and good luck with your memory, as well.
• I would caution you to be very, very careful with hypnosis. While the evidence to how successful it can be at recovering old memories is somewhat controversial, there is quite strong evidence that it can be very good at implanting memories of things that haven't happened. Since memory is several degrees removed from actual experience, a strong suggestion that something happened can end up being encoded in the same way an actual memory of the event might. Experiments have even been done (and I'm sorry I don't have a link to some documentation on this) where hyptonists intentionally planted false memories in a person, who then swears up and down that false event occurred. Of course, you don't need hyptnotism to do that - a lot of police interrogation techniques are designed to basically do just this, which is why witness testimonials are notoriously unreliable. It's a kind of scary thought that we can remember things as they didn't happen, or didn't happen at all - much scarier, to me, than the idea of simply forgetting. But I should give a disclaimer: none of this is coming from personal experience, just from reading. And feel better, humor.
• humoreffect, after reading this thread, it occurs to me that blogging might aid your future recall. You would be able to keep a record of daily events or imporetant weekly happneings in your life. Failing this, you could try keeping a journal/diary if you don't already.
• ...but I can't help but think that if I don't work on recalling my old memories, what's the point of making new ones? I'm just going to forget them anyways. Just forget about that ;)
• Nonsense. All that we really have are our memories. If someone completely erased my memory tomorrow, I might as well be dead. It is all we have to define and validate who we are. Keep making memories, and make as many as you can. Anything worth forgetting is twice as valuable to remember.
• To preface, thanks for listening/talking, everyone. bernockle: Exactly. Which is why it bothers me so much that I can't remember all of those things that are so important. Beeswacky, as a matter of fact, last week I decided to start keeping a journal. Only problem is that by the beginning of this week, I forgot that I was supposed to be keeping one. Roach: Yeah, I'm kinda wary of hypnotism, and you've just reinforced that. I kind of have a feeling that this is something that's either going to work out on its own, or that I'm going to have to figure out without someone walking me through it, since everyone's different. Thanks for your well wishes, though. Since I'm still not quite clear about this, if I wanted to make some sort of update on my situation (ie, if I have some sort of breaktrough, I find something that really works for me, or my novel) how would I go about doing that, here? Thanks again.
• humoreffect, you can search for this thread and post to it again. The threads don't really ever close around here, so it'll pop up on our sidebars if there's a recent comment. You could also post your info about the novel on your profile page. Good luck to you!
• humoreffect - thanks for the new post on the kids helping kids walk. I thought it would be good to put this thread back on the side bar to introduce you to folks who haven't met you. When you have time, I'd love it if you would update us on how you are doing - adding comments to this thread would work. I've thought of you often, but had forgotten your name (bit of irony?)
• Thanks for bumping this back to the sidebar, path. humoreffect: I've had memory problems in the past (illness related) and something which really helped me was trying to figure out exactly how my memory worked. As others have said up-thread, the brain is a gigantic intricately wired web of information: the more neurological associations there are to a specific memory, the more likely you are to be able to recall it. It was helpful for me to divide the process into the different senses - visual, oral, aural, kinetic and so on. My aural memory, it turns out, is by far my strongest: I remember words people say to me and inflections and so on much better than I do visuals, and I generally remember words much better than I do pictures, so quite frequently I'll describe things I'm seeing to myself so that I also give myself the memory of formulating and then hearing the words. My kinetic memory is also quite good, so with phone numbers for instance, I'm more likely to recall the sequence of physical movements of hitting the keypad than the actual numbers themselves. Also, oddly enough, different temperatures are a major trigger for me - feeling a certain kind of heat or breathing a certain kind of cold air brings memories flooding back that don't know how I would have accessed otherwise. Point being: the more different senses and sensations you can tie to a particular fact or event, the more likely you are to be able to remember it clearly. Not sure if any of this is useful for things that have already happened, but may help a bit for the future. Also well worth investigating is the delightful notion of the Memory Palace - creating a building in your mind, and furnishing it with objects mnemonically tied to things you want to remember, and then imagining yourself wandering through it to trigger recall. I've not read it, but by all accounts The Memory Palace of Matteo Ricci by Jonathan Spence is a good read on the subject. (I also notice that amazon have a 'buy this book together with...' deal with that and The Art of Memory by Frances Yates; I've not read that particular book either, but she is the most incredible historian and writes very engagingly, so that might be of interest too) Sorry for the rambling post. Please let us know how you're getting on if you'd like. And best of luck with the walk on the 14th!