December 21, 2004

• Impeachment? War crimes? Never gonna happen. I wish it could, but it won't. The American public will forget this by next week. The US media probably won't even give it cursory coverage. This is how cynical I have become about it. The only thing that's gonna bring this guy his just deserts is a sniper.
• 'Forget it by next week'?! You are too optimistic, my dear lad. The Amrican public already has zero interest in this. Now excuse me, I have to go buy 3,450,021 Christmas presents as it says in the Bible.
• Something is gonna happen real soon, oh wait,,Gonna be startin sumpin`, Gonna be startin sumpin`
• Somebody's lying and I think we all know who it is. Yeah, it's that damn liberal media. I won't believe it till I see it on Fox.
• "impeachment" refers to "high crimes and misdemeanors," usually meaning treason or cirumventing the Constitution - I dont see how this qualifies, although it could possibly be construed as an abuse of Commander in Chief powers. "war crimes" tends to refer to genocide and things of that nature- no one died here. And I am with the conservatives on not particularly wanting to see an American president on trial in the Hague. I would like to see a serious investigation, followed by bipartisan pressure building on Bush to resign. I just dont see how the semi-hysterical call for "impeachment and war crimes" every time Bush is mentioned in the news helps.
• It's the Christian thing to do. yikes
• Why don't you want to see an American president on trial for war crimes?
• Just one question.
• So do we qualify yet as a Stalinist democracy?
• Yea, where's the gulag? We need more gulag.
• I'd love to have my name engraved on that bullet, Nostrildamus. I'd settle for a war crimes trial for the whole goddamn bunch, though, as long as they were summarily found guilty.
• [...] trial [...] as long as they were summarily found guilty. 'I'll be judge, I'll be jury,' Said cunning old Fury: 'I'll try the whole cause, and condemn you to death.'

• The American public will forget this by next week.

  No, justified it. Look at the reaction to torture camps.
• I wonder if coppermac would be so hostile to Bush and his loyalists if they were found to be a bunch of homos.
• The only thing that's gonna bring this guy his just deserts is a sniper. I'd love to have my name engraved on that bullet Those of us who embrace the spirit of dissent have waited years for Bush: An embodiment of the establishment's abuses and its collective attitude. Someone to rally against, someone to disagree with in full. And this is what we get out of it? Violence fantasies? This is the thinking man's response to "bomb 'em all?" This is what the motherfucking intellectual high ground sounds like? So do we qualify yet as a Stalinist democracy? Okay, there is clearly a place for hyperbole in this debate. I've done it myself on t-shirts, where the focus is on impact and brevity. But if the slogans and exaggerations that idiots like me print on shirts are the whole of the discussion, we're doing the world a disservice. I swear, I'm so sick of the people "on my side" that the hate mail I get is almost refreshing. I hear enough nonsense about how Bush is evil incarnate and I start to yearn for the novelty of a grammatically-questionable email threatening my life and inviting me to move to France. as long as they were summarily found guilty. Coppermac, I swear I don't mean any offense to you personally, and I'm only lashing out at a convenient target that is reminding me of months of frustrations, but here we go: Punishing people without a fair trial (and beyond the punishments we've deemed acceptable for everyone) is exactly what we're so fucking pissed about here. To say that you'd only support a trial on the condition of a guilty verdict is mind-boggling. Trials don't seek verdicts, they seek answers. If you don't agree, why the holy goddamn aren't you kissing George W. Bush's feet for perverting criminal justice to become exactly the system you're asking for? Here's why you don't: He's on the other team, but you've all agreed to the rules. The way the game is played doesn't matter to anyone, only who wins. Their team has the ball, so it's our turn to grab the facemask. Excuse me if I'm sick of playing.
• Trials don't seek verdicts, they seek answers. If you don't agree, why the holy goddamn aren't you kissing George W. Bush's feet for perverting criminal justice to become exactly the system you're asking for? I think coppermac isn't an American. Or, at least, he's a lapsed American. He is allowed his fantasies because the act of "kissing [Dubya]'s feet" isn't political for him as it would be for an American.
• drjimmy: a war crimes trial in the Hague would hardly be enough. Unfortunately there is not a court high enough to try this perversion of the spirit of what we as a nation are supposed to represent. We're the ones who are supposed to stand up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the ones crushed by the oppressors, for those who live without even the hope of freedom. Instead, we are become no better than those we claim the right to punish. If it requires being put on trial in the Hague, so be it. /end rant
• Be patient, it *may* happen. Look at Pinochet's current tribulations. With a little luck, they reach a verdict in a dozen years and send him to the gas chamber in effigy! On your lifetime, you said? Oh, well, now, that's a little difficult... (Seriously, I've lost hope on anything waking up USA public reaction. Had some glimmer of it, at the time of Abu Ghraib, for some Watergate-like event. Instead, the public spoke, showing the huge division of the population)
• "And this is what we get out of it? Violence fantasies?" - Mmm.. no, not really a violence fantasy. I oppose violence. It was more of an observation. "This is the thinking man's response to "bomb 'em all?" This is what the motherfucking intellectual high ground sounds like?" - The intellectual high ground? Isn't that where we retreat when there's a flood of stupidity? Actually, I've become increasingly pessimistic about the efficacy of intellect to solve anything, given the events of the last few years. Not that I endorse radicalism, but I am rather tired of navel-gazing, polite rebukes for mendacity & the impotent pomposity of mendicant pseuds. The conclusion that I come to is that most everyone is a fuckhead & that the best bet for those of us born 'a skin short' as Spike Milligan used to say, is to yell hang the sense of it & retire to some distant, uninhabited island somewhere. But, as a professed pacifist & attempted Buddhist, I have been debating with myself whether the assassination of Bush would not, in fact, be a moral act. Would it, in fact, be a cathartic act of self-preservation? Don't say retribution or justice, for such things are meaningless mental constructs. From a pure, basic human point of view, would someone's self-sacrifice in taking out Bush & a few cronies on, say, Inauguration day, be a monumentally heroic (albeit suicidal) act of compassion for thousands, perhaps millions of people? Probably not. Where's an atlas? Time to start looking for an island. Dibs on Pacific.
• From the very beginning, this administration has been been stifling any voices against it. Immediatly we were told not to criticize it in any way, and they began throwing people in jail with little or no exidence of an actual crime. Remember the guy that had that website "RAISE THE FIST?" That should have woke up the sleepers. It is amazing what`s going on, but the oil addicted christian right wing has been planning this for some thirty years. There was an article in Mother Jones a few months ago tracing back to when this part of the plan to take over began.(I can`t find that article) As much as that one document,,The Shadow of the Swastika, seems ludicrous, because it`s a pro marijuana document, that was the actual beginning of what is happening now. Oil companies worked hard to reduce us to relying on their products, instead of products and resources at that were mostly recyclable, including tricks as convincing farmers to trade in their plow horses for tractors, and subsidizing roads to eliminate trolleys,,etc. So now, our society, and modern societies, are addicted, and the addicts are being led around like crack whores, and when the man says "Trick" all eyes are on him, regardless of the hard crash that they know will follow. They still have Jesus,, which is an imaginary hero, who will never let them down. (sorry)Ramble onRamble onRamble onRamble on
• You can't have dibs on the entire Pacific. At least let me have Oahu.
• If you kill Bush, you will give the radical right in the US complete victory. Assassinate him only if you hate the US enough to destroy it. Keep in mind that an openly Fascist US will not think twice to use nuclear weapons, so be sure to hide your traces well.
• I'm not touching him. I'm not wasting my life on a fuckhead like that. I'm just musing.
• I always feel that when we focus on figureheads like Bush we're being trolled successfully by the entrenched interests that administrations like his serve. The old anarchist strategy of propaganda by the deed, which accounted for a fair few kings and presidents at the end of the 19th century turned out to be a blind alley, justified as it may well have been. I really hope people don't feel like Nostril says he does (much as I can sympathise) and retreat from it all. The concessions won from power over the centuries are few but precious and certainly worth defending as best we can. My grandparents' generation achieved so much. Of course not all of it lasted but their compassion, courage and endeavour certainly inspired me. Although the mass movements they were part of seem to have gone, I hope I can do my part to tend the liberty tree for the generations yet to come. I can't pretend to have much in the way of a strategy but I've tried to always keep participating, more in hope than anticipation.
• I'm just musing. If you are truly a Buddhist, then you'll recall that the Buddha rejected violence as a legitimate means of achieving one's ends. You're musing about pretty basic things. Now of course there have been Buddhist thinkers who have tried to justify violence in various ways. Look to Imperial Japan to see prominent Zen scholars arguing for war, assassination, suicide attacks, even atrocities like the Nanjing massacre. Modern thinkers reject these arguments as failures of the Zen tradition. Even though Zen claims to be purely amoral, and was believed by some to be a perfection of Buddhism, it was still primarily a Shinto-influenced local branch of Buddhism, heavily influenced by politics; see for instance the nonsense about the Samurai code, etc. You won't find a Zen thinker today who advocates violence. I regret to say that there are still some Buddhists who don't get it. I believe we've talked about Tessa J. Bartholemeu's In defense of Dharma: Just-war ideology in Buddhist Sri Lanka on MoFi before, but that appears to have been lost in the Great October Crash. I forget what the consensus was, but Sri Lankan Buddhism is again by no means a popular take on it. Most Buddhists will agree with my first statement, I'll wager.
• Buddha mused on the topic violence before he rejected it. I don't think Buddha wants you to blindly obey him, but to use contemplation to reach the the altitudes he reached. substitute your diety of choice in place of Buddha, the statement will usually remain valid.
• OK, I'll play. My diety of choice is... Dr. Atkins. I don't think he rejected violence. Inducing ketosis seems like a horribly violent way to lose weight.
• Last week, I visited the temple Tripitaka established on his return to China from India in AD 537 (I think).
• PS -- I am not a Buddhist. I am not an anythingist.
• OK, I'm a jazzist.
• You're a squintist.
• How's little Miss Wolof? - herself as precious as scriptures!
• You're a bassist. Had to be said. :P
• Miss Wolof is amazing, in about twenty different ways. A real thinking person. Congrats on your upcoming marriage, dj, she's quite obviously a lovely girl!
• Monkeyfilter: from FBI memos to engagement congratulations in 34 comments.
• Not to be hatin'... I think it's cute. Congratulations all around.
• And people say there's no such thing as ADHD. ;) /nods @ Wolof. /nods @ dj.
• Whee! *throws confetti all round*
• Hutta, I think people are frustrated by the continued moral outrage perpetuated by this administration coupled with a disturbing lack of its accountability and the decreasing prospects of ever achieving any. As a consequence, people have very few places to express their anger and Presto!- you get over the top comments and calls for assasination. I'm really, really angry too, but stop short of these comments mainly because as we now live pretty much in Zappa's predicted Fascist Theocracy (1986), I worry mainly about the possibilty of joining those poor wretches at Gitmo. I also primarily blame the US people who have to rank up their as being (collectively) one of the stupidest, supposedly informed and educated populace's in history. Yeah Bushco started it, but would have gotten nowhere without the assent of the US sheeple. I could go further, but I don't need Godwin to be invoked- not just yet anyway.
• Also congratulations all! And Wolof, see ya at the Jazzist Temple Sunday, OK?
• ( Cardenio steps in front of Nostrildamus and pushes gun away ) CARDENIO : Nostrildamus no ! If you shoot him ... you'll ... you'll be just as bad as he is ! NOSTRILDAUMS : This has gone too far ! Someone's got to do something ! Get out of my way Cardenio ! ( Enter Cavolonero ) CAVOLONERO : Wait ! I have a plan !
• Actually, I've become increasingly pessimistic about the efficacy of intellect to solve anything, given the events of the last few years. Not that I endorse radicalism, but I am rather tired of navel-gazing, polite rebukes for mendacity & the impotent pomposity of mendicant pseuds. I have never been more thoroughly in agreement with another member of this site, and it depresses the holy hell out of me. I used to think that calmly and intelligently presenting the truth and arguing for the ethical would eventually prevail. Now I'm beginning to suspect that it's all about the McNuggets.
• EMPEROR BUSH: I feel the anger within you, young Nostrildamus. Look - here is your lightsabre. I am a defenceless old man. Take it and strike me down. Then your journey to the dark side will be complete! NOSTRILDAMUS fidgets nervously, then grabs the weapon, and attempts to strike EMPEROR BUSH. Mid-slash, his lightsabre is blocked by that of DARTH RUMSFELD. DARTH RUMSFELD: You cannot defeat me, my son. NOSTRILDAMUS: Noooooo! Screen wipe
• sorry i geeked out a little there
• But it made me laugh. Thanks. :D
• Wolof! That "Cunning Old Fury" quote was the start of my honors thesis (about a judge assuming legislative powers). Yay!
• ( later in the car ) NOSTRILDAMUS : So you're saying that completely privatizing education is actually a good thing ? CARDENIO : That's not a plan. That's your plan ? That's not a plan. CAVOLONERO : It's the basis of the plan. Look ; the whole thing, " America ", is jumping the shark. What we have to do is be in the right position when it all comes down. NOSTRILDAMUS : I don't see how this is a plan.
• All we can do is try to educate the masses. Then we just hope that the masses will do the right thing. In this case, the masses are probably never going to hear about these emails. We need to make sure that they do. How do we do this? Well, I tell people. I tell people who I think do not know. If enough people are interested, then maybe CNN or someone will really run it. God knows if there was an email claiming that Clinton was having a special-order podium fitted to accomodate crouching interns, then CNN would already have it on their front page.
• It's in the New York Times today. Beyond providing new details about the nature and extent of abuses, if not the exact times or places, the newly disclosed documents are the latest to show that such activities were known to a wide circle of government officials. You still have an opportunity to alienate "the masses" with a semi-hysterical lefty circle jerk, however. So everybody, get blogging.
• Just to continue the apathy... I started reading the comments and came across fuguyare's random number of xmas gifts perscribed by the bible and decided to google it, thinking it could be intentional. Turns out it is not. Turns out I care more about a potentially meaningless number than I do about my governMEANT taking us all up the ass. Sad state of affairs, I say.
• Oooo-oooh! Look who's getting all "Count Dooku" on us all of a sudden.
• For the lazy monkeys (NYT link) And congrats to all engaged, newly weds and with babies! It proves that at least some of you haven't lost all hope.
  
• if it's not clear to you all yet...well, yes, it is I who is lying. Not Bush, not the quid, not goetter...but I. Sorry.
• 'impeachment' refers to 'high crimes and misdemeanors,' usually meaning treason or cirumventing the Constitution Or blowjobs, or lying about blowjobs. That bar's a little lower these days.
• Are you saying that perjury is not a high crime or misdemeanor?
• Nice try, fuyugare. My hostility to the real terrorists (Bush and accomplices) is valid. hutta: we know the accused is guilty, so i'd only be satisfied if the outcome of the trial reflected reality. This isn't some lame Law and Order episode - we know that the U.S. government illegally and immorally invaded a sovereign nation and has killed tens of thousands of the citizens of Iraq. They've allowed and encouraged rape, murder and torture, and they deserve to be punished for it. If any such trial were to have the same vote-scamming and fraud abuses as the recent presidential election in the U.S., we'd just see the idiot Bush and his fellow criminals summarily found 'not guilty'. Is that acceptable? Perhaps you feel that there have been no crimes committed in or on Iraq and its people. What sort of 'fair trial' could exist considering this debacle? No U.S. decisions on this matter would or should ever be accepted by any sane people, and the very twits who re-elected the terrorist just a short while ago would reject any world court decision they didn't like. Best of luck in sorting this out, but I highly doubt that any solution will be found.
• The Reuters article says nothing about the connection with Bush advocating said abuses... while the CNN/AP version mentions it but uses the the title "ACLU: Gitmo interrogators posed as FBI" and the lead "The Pentagon is investigating new allegations by a civil liberties group...". And I wonder why I bother googling random numbers.
• The BBC says that one of the FBI agents involved wrote that Bush gave an executive order to allow "sleep management" and "stress positions". In a surprise move, the White House has denied this allegation.
• Goetter: You still have an opportunity to alienate "the masses" with a semi-hysterical lefty circle jerk, however. What would you suggest? It seems no one gives a flying shit otherwise. Congress? The Republicans know which side their bread is buttered on, and while they're not exactly kowtowing to the Emperor Bush, I don't see any moral outrage from them. The Democrats don't have enough power to do anything. The public doesn't seem to give a damn - hell, a goodly portion seem to support the idea that we're torturing human beings. Maybe you're right. Maybe it's time to just bail on this country and let it die. Aside from a few good people, it seems no one here is worth fighting for.
• You should stay to watch the Republican Party methodically destroy itself. It's bleak entertainment, but it'll give you fond memories. Leave before the end, though.
• Maybe it's all cyclical. The Dems will recover and meanwhile the Republican Party will implode from within. And so it will go for another eight-ten years, until the reverse occurs.
• OK, there has been just a tiny bit of chatter about these emails on NPR. Everywhere else the story about the mess-hall attack dominates all Iraq coverage. Everyone on the right in the internet is, justifiably, calling for our mandate-endowed leader to just unleash the nukes on Iraq already. Seriously, it is high time to make these terrorists pay for all the suffering they're inflicting on our troops. Everyone on the left, aka. 'wrong' side, is trying to spin it as a 'mistake' on the part of the Bush administration. Where the fuck have they been? How dare they impugn the war effort! Don't these Kerry-voters, aka. Saddam-loyalists, know that they lost? If they are so worried about mistakes, why don't they enlist? Go guard the damn mess halls if you are worried about the troops. Oh wait, I forgot, you haven't pulled your fat ass out of that chair in months. It is just soooo easy to sit around and blame the troops, isn't it? Bunch of whiny bastards, all of them.
• The blogosphere is a scary place these days. I really ought to kick my RSS reader in the dustbin and read some kitten mags.
• But Rumsfeld is a nice guy, W. said so! He takes kids for pony rides and has a collection of Care Bears.
• dj, so does Michael Jackson.
• Q: What time is bedtime at Neverland? A: When the big hand touches the little hand.
• )
• I need a shower after that joke.
• U.N.: Guantanamo detainees should be freed or tried The U.S. government should release all suspected terrorists it's holding at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, or try them, the United Nations said Thursday.