November 28, 2004

• The Salvation Army's whole thing kind of gives me the willies. Probably because they call themselves an army instead of, I don't know, the Salvation Warm Fuzzy Group of Helper People. I never drop change in the bucket, but I don't have much money to spare, either. I do my part throughout the year by tipping well (thereby giving it directly to people who need it), and by donating items to charities I like. Clothes and household items go to Goodwill, and once or twice a year I'll drop off a giant bundle of newspapers and canned cat food at the local animal shelter.
• I never donate to the Salvation Army. Unlike certain presidents of the United States, I don't believe in the the integrity of faith-based help organisations. I'd rather give to Oxfam, the IRCS, or MSF.
• I give the drunks and crack addicts manning the buckets my pocket change sometimes.
• I would never support the Salvation Army given their various philosophies. Recently, they cancelled a contracted-for speech by Reagan's daughter because of her support for stem cell research--and refused to pay even the cancellation fee stipulated in the contract.
• I don't donate to the S.A. either. If asked, I'd tell you that its because I am against their christian agenda, which I am. But the honest reason is the F**king ringing drives me insane. I'd rather donate blood and money to the Red Cross and my time to organizations that I believe in. Please make the ringing stop
• I heard that Target is not letting the SA solicit there this year. Have you seen them there? From what I've read, Target has pretty good politics for a corporation, so I figured that something was fishy with SA. It could be their stance on homosexuality that kept them out of Target (if that is, indeed, true).
• Uh their stance on homosexuality, apparently, is that you shouldn't have gay sex if you are a christian. It leaves quite a bit of room for interperetation, and may just be a don't get AIDS clause. As for me, I don't give them money because they'll just give it to blacks and hispanics. Their kids bring knives to school and frankly I'm sick of all their bullshit.
• I blame this "Jay See" character.
• Him and that nazi crooner morrissey.
• Um, actuallysettle, I'm assuming your joking- but even so thats some poor taste
• Salvation Army runs important shelters for the homeless, where there might not be any others. They feed them. They give toys to poor children at Christmas. That is good enough for me. If you have a problem with it, than give directly to the poor yourself - it's more emotionally difficult, because it puts you face to face with the need, but it's more rewarding. There are so many homeless where I live, for instance, that it can be overwhelming, but I give a dollar or so when I can. It's worst in winter, because the shelters here charge, even when it is so cold that someone could die. They don't report freezing deaths on the news. I wish they would - I wish they would post up notices all over campus. People need to be shaken from their complacency.
• There are much better places than the Salvation Army to donate. I personally have a problem with them because of reasons already stated, but also because of their donation policies--it's really hard to give them stuff. Also, at my local Starbucks they stopped taking the food donations (nearly everything expires at the end of the day) because it wasn't financially "feasable" for them anymore whatever that means. It makes me wonder what the hell they're doing anymore.
• Speaking of the kettle, I just bought a bottle of Kettle One and will be making a kettle of chicken soup tonight.
• meredithea: Target stopped allowing bellringer because they do not fit the "hip youth" image they want to promote. Stance on homosexuality aside, I don't think that's "good politics".
• Yes, I drop my change in the kettle. They fed and clothed and housed me when I could not do any of that for myself. They never asked for payment. At no time was anyone refused shelter while I stayed with them; sometimes they had to sneak people in when firelaws would have prohibited. I don't give them money because I feel beholden to them, I give them money because I want to help the desperately poor --but not directly. I lived the life, I don't need the drama. Some people do. They get a high off of working with the destitute that nothing else can touch. They feed off of it. I personally get an almost uncontrollable urge to vomit around these types, but I recognize the need for them. So yeah, I put it in the bucket.
• The Salvation Army is one of our favorite charities. As Peter Drucker has shown, they are one of the most efficient charities in the world. They have a 150+ year history of helping the neediest of the needy. In the aftermath of 9/11 they worked quietly behind the scenes providing all kinds of help. Unlike the American Red Cross, and others, you did not see them boo-hooing to the media about how they needed more money. They did not use the crisis to increase their coffers. Yet they were (I think) the second largest contributor to direct relief (behind ARC). Joan Kroc (not known as a raving conservative) gave them $1.5 billion to help build community centers thorughout the U.S. to help inner city youth. Let the little people who want to withhold their money because of some pet political peeve do so. Those who are willing to give, without getting something in return, will help the Salvation Army continue for another 150 years. Take your money and your crying somewhere else.
• PatB, you and others like you make it really difficult for me to hate the human race. dammit.
• dt118 - I don't think that with holding money from a charity that does not hold my beliefs makes me "little". I donate my money to charities I believe in and I also regularly donate my time. I agree that the S.A. does many great acts, but I do not agree with there stances on homosexuality among other things. As far as their methods of gathering money, I much prefer the ARC's methods than the Salvation Army. I truly find the ringing offensive, but, to each his or her own.
• I do the Salvation Army Angel Tree. I don't have any kids to shop for, so it feels more like Christmas than anything else I do during the holiday season.
• Kimberly, I ran a food shelf/thrift shop for a group of churches for a couple of years and let me tell you, I completely sympathize with the SA's strict donation policies. You'd be suprised what kind of crap people donate unthinkingly. Our policy was 'if its too worn or stained or just plain ugly for YOU to wear, PLEASE don't palm it off on us' We'd still get hundreds of pounds of unusable articles whenever an apartment fire or winter holiday would tweak people's consciences and we would have to pay to recycle. Imagine how much more the SA has to deal with on a national level.
• Yes, the shelters of all kinds have to follow certain rules. I remember being told I could not donate day old donuts from our shop to one teen shelter, because their rules did not allow them to take random donations because they served minors. The adult women's shelter down the road was okay with it, but it was a very small shelter (less liability). My family actually used to get food that could not be given out at the foodbank - such as beans with pork that were sent to a foodbank in a Muslim neighbourhood, frozen food they didn't have the storage capacity for. The woman who ran it knew we could at least use it, as she either couldn't store it or give it away. Actually, I was wondering if there was anyway to donate/recycle clothing with rips in it. I wear out trousers, but there is still a lot of good material that could be used, or made into cotton paper. But I don't know where to take rags.
• boo_radley: that makes me sad. boooo Target (not a pun on your name -- honest!) PatB: I used to work at a place that offered a number of services, including an emergency food bank and free clothes. Our rule for clothes donation was that the clothes had to be nice enough for kids to wear to school and for adults to wear to jobs or job interviews (this place was a type of stopgap for people trying to keep their heads above water: the working poor or those who hoped to *become* the working poor). These rules were rarely followed. Finally, we said "if it's not nice enough to wear to church, we won't take it!" People understood that a little better. The Salvation Army took what we would not. Whenever I have extra cash to give, I give it to this place.
• Count me amongst the kettle droppers. I tend to shy away from giving to large charities (I have three that I typically give to, and two are neighborhood-type orgs, the other one is a hospital), but the SA, regardless of its politics, seems like it does good work with minimal financial chicanery. Large charities with high payroll and overhead piss me off.
• boo_radley: Do you have facts to back up that claim?
• Target stopped allowing bellringer because they do not fit the "hip youth" image they want to promote. Stance on homosexuality aside, I don't think that's "good politics". Nope. Target stopped allowing bell ringers because they want to stick to their "no solicitation" policy. I suspect they will be donating a chunk of money behind the scenes to make up for the $9 million or so that the Army will lose by not ringing there. This is a huge loss in the Twin Cities because there are so many Targets here. What many people don't realize is that your local Salvation Army chapter, the one that feeds the homeless directly, gets its yearly operating revenue from the red kettles. The money flows upward from the local chapters to the headquarters, not the other way around. I usually put something in the kettle when I see one. That said, I have my own issues with the SA and the way they treat women in their ranks, which is far from "equal" no matter what they say.
• I don't donate, but the reason why isn't so much political as practical. The company that I work for also employs many of the same folks that are out there ringin' the bells, and so I get to know things like that the guy outside of Borders carries a pair of tongs with him, to fish out any bill $5 or greater. From talking to them, the level of graft is so institutionalized that even when they're caught, they're not fired for more than a week (of course, there probably aren't many people who want to stand and ring a bell for 10 hours either...)
• That's interesting js. The corps where I helped count money one year (long story) was very hard-line about theft. But knowing what I know, I am willing to say that was an exception.
• Argh. My Google-fu is NOT working today. While I have some trepidation about the kettles themselves, the SA is a charity I strongly favor. And not for their beliefs or their values, which frankly seem a little cultlike in their use of the army motif; but rather because their insanely high direct-aid ratio. Which is to say, for every dollar you donate, a large chunk actually goes to helping somebody, somehow (be it food, shelter, or clothing). I recall reading that most other charities struggle to get to even a 50% ratio; and many smaller charities are in endowment mode, which means that your dollar may never actually go towards helping anybody. The SA is doing something like 80% (here is where the google-fu fails me, I recall reading a newspaper article that did independent calculations and compared 10 different charities. I cannot find it as of now). Now, if you have the time or the energy, I'm sure you can find a local charity that has a higher ratio. I'm sure the local food bank might be able to top an 80% ratio. But if you're stingy, or busy, or care enough to give but not enough to do the legwork, you can give to the SA and be reasonably confident that a majority of your hard earned dollar will tangibly help someone this year.
• Has anybody called the kettle black yet?
• SA Sargeant talks about image problems in this NPR Article
• There are a lot of reasons that I will never donate to Salvation Army. And yes, I'm pretty sure that voting with my money counts as a "valid" form of protest. It's not like it's that hard to find a local charity that doesn't have the taint of discrimination that Salvation Army carries. I've given my time and money to many local groups that don't feel the need to discriminate against anyone for any reason. As far as "Take your money and your crying somewhere else." How about this? No. The Salvation Army receives hundreds of millions of dollars in government funding every year. You are aware of that, right? It doesn't operate solely through donations, and since I'm apparently supporting them whether I want to or not, I believe I'm entitled to a say in the matter.
• Mervyn's To Allow Kettles. It's interesting to note: Mervyn's parent company is Target.