November 27, 2004

• There are plenty of objective measures for diamonds, but in the end it's a clever combination of marketing scheme and forced scarcity that makes valuable. Personally, I couldn't be happier if the industry is in for a shake-up. Keep an eye out for a mysterious death of Mr. Mark Vadon, though.
• Nice Slithy. I thought we should all be shunning the diamond trade for its hand in Sierra Leone. I just can't keep up with consumer boycotts anymore. I'm also interested in the artificially made stones they are starting to churn out now. That coupled with Blue Nile's approach could indeed mean a shake up.
• Blue Nile may be the upset to the precariously balanced and carefully nurtured scam that is the diamond industry. If so, they will likely be among the first to suffer, since they have less of a profit buffer than most. Or Blue Nile may be a calculated bone thrown to the increasing number of sops who have cottoned on; meant to dupe us into thinking we're getting the best of master manipulator DeBeers, and thus buy our silence through self-deluded satisfaction. Meanwhile the rest of the oblivious herd continues to buy these worthless pebbles from the regular selection of over-priced merchants. Allowed to prosper solely to further the lifespan of the diamond scam.
• Peachy, the manmade diamond guys were the first thing I thought of when I read the title. It says a lot about the success of De Beers brainwashing propaganda that a perfect stone from a crucible would be valued less than a lesser stone that came out of the ground. Reason has little to do with it when it comes to diamonds.
• Reason has little to do with most human activitites.
• It says a lot about the success of De Beers brainwashing propaganda that a perfect stone from a crucible would be valued less than a lesser stone that came out of the ground. Not that I'm interested in defending DeBeers (I can't stand 'em), but to be fair, they've never done any advertising to that effect that I saw when I worked in the retail jewelry business, and I was in it for ten years. In fact, there are a number of companies (Chatham the most prominent) that have a huge vested interest in getting consumer attention for lab-grown gemstones and have spent millions upon millions in the name of expanding customer awareness. Believe me, you can explain all you want to customers that a lab grown sapphire is a real sapphire, better quality for less money and almost zero negative environmental impact, and nine out of ten will turn their noses up at it. It's not the same thing if it's grown in a lab, they think. It's like being told how the magic trick works, exactly like the big dust-up over colored stone enhancements some years ago -- some of these techniques have been going on in plain view for centuries, but news magazine shows shrieked when they "found out" about them. Sure, DeBeers would rather keep man-made diamonds down. But if they can't, they'll adapt, believe me. The real fear of lab-grown diamonds is that they're getting harder and harder to detect, which means that an unscrupulous wholesaler could wind up costing an unsuspecting mom-and-pop operation one hell of a lot of money in legal expenses.
• Diamonds make me irrational all around. I hate the ad campaigns that say if I don't get the big rock I'm unloved, or the commercials that say I should get mad at whomever I'm with if they don't shell out for jewelry. (ie, the "He got it at Jared" commercials) At the same time, I inherited my grandmother's jewelry, and I got kind of excited about it. Sometimes, the silly girl part of me takes over.
• But meredithea, wouldn't you rather have diamonds made from your grandmother?
• Blood diamonds vs. awesome diamonds, choices, choices.
• >>rare, mysterious, magical, romantic i do believe that diamonds are NONE of the above, that we've just bought into the mystique that debeers has created over the years. mid, can you speak to that? i've read that there are millions of more diamonds available than are on the market, that debeers controls their flow into retail and thus keeps the prices inflated -- and convinces folks that diamonds are "rare" when they're not. any truth to that? or urban legend?
• Yowza, ooga_booga! But from what I have heard about cremation, you can't be sure that you're getting the ashes of the person you ... um ... want to have the ashes of (oh, the delicacy!). So I could think that I had a big honkin' grandma ring, when actually I had a big honkin' stranger ring, which would be creepy. (Or, you know, creepy-ER...)
• SideDish, I've heard that too.
• The diamond industry will prosper as long as a majority of women measure their worth in terms of how much their man spends on the ring. I know the industry has marketed it that way, but the power to change things rests with the women.
• Ten reasons not to buy a diamond.
• A little more on the worth of diamonds.
• It is also men who choose to buy them. I have a lovely silver band, as does my fiance ($6 each, as we never stop boasting - and he still owes me). They match, which is much more symbolic than a diamond. That said, sometimes I'm a bit disapointed I don't have a diamond - it would have been so useful for cutting windows when I'm playing at being a secret agent.
• My ex and I were (are) non-traditional and she, particularly, initially disliked the idea of rings. After we got married, though, she became markedly more sentimental and, as a surprise, our first xmas she bought us matching gold bands. But we were very poor and they weren't real gold. We were at her parents', and her father took this very seriously and was insisting that he'd get the rings sized for us. We had to explain to him that they were plastic. My parents took us out and bought as two rings, though. I got a plain gold band that cost about $50. She got something a little nicer. They were more than nice enough for us. It's amazing how few people know that the second-hand market for diamonds is awful. My grandmother was given an expensive engagement ring (well, actually, she was given 15K to buy it herself) by a man she didn't marry. The day of her funeral, my aunt lost the ring somewhere in the cemetary. She was heartbroken. Now, since my grandmother didn't want to be buried with the ring, it couldn't have had that much sentimental value. My aunt thinks that it had monetary value, but I explained to her that it was in actuality worth not very much at all.
• Meredithea - I'd heard the same thing regarding the authenticity of cremains. You're right - not only would it be kind of creepy going around showing off that big honking rock which used to be Gramma, but it would be even creepier once you realize that it's a big honking rock which used to be 2 parts Gramma, 1 part Joey Griffin and 1 part assorted parts. Besides, what was Gramma doing with that Joey Griffin character anyway? And what was his part doing in Gramma's parts? Ewww...
• kmellis, that's true. i have a gorgeous ring set from my first marriage, it's a .72 diamond engagement ring, 12-ruby anniversary band and plain wedding band. they're all set in thick gold. we paid around $2,500. i called a few jewelers after my divorce to see if they purchased "used" stuff -- nope. they said it's worthless. i asked if the gems themselves woudln't be worth something; nope. i just don't get it.
• ooga-booga: exactly!
• (derailish) I think jewelers don't like used stuff is cuz they can't resell it as easily.. especially like wedding bands and stuff that come out of a divorce; why would someone want to buy a symbol of a failed marriage? (not trying to be mean but..) but then, the jeweler could just melt the thing down.
• Diamonds aren't generally worth anything used because of the way the market is structured. 1) There is absolutely no shortage of diamonds. In fact, there is a glut which DeBeers absorbs by warehousing them. 2) Because of the artificiality of the market, large jewelers apparently don't pay DeBeers up front for diamonds. They are given a shipment 'on consignment' and then pay once they've sold them. As a result, there's no incentive for most jewelers to buy used rocks when they're already getting the new ones for free (at least until they've sold). The exception are unusually large and thus slightly rarer stones, but they still aren't going to be worth anything close to original retail. The jeweler is only going to be interested if he can pick them up for a song.
• When I got engaged, I was hoping for either no diamond, or a synthetic one. But no diamond wasn't an option because my fiance's childhood friend is a jeweler, and the synthetic ones weren't readily available. Thankfully, my man still came up with something good. An irradiated diamond. They take yellow or brown diamonds that would normally not be sold, hit them with gamma rays, then throw them in a lead box for a few years. The diamonds turn blue or green, or even red. Here are a some examples. My ring has one that is sky-blue. So, while I hate the fact that child laborers probably dug up something I wear every day, at least it is a nerdy, partially recycled diamond. Plus, it freaks out jewelers. When I went to get the ring sized, the snooty lady behind the counter assumed it was zirconium, then synthetic, and then passed me on to her manager. He appologized for her by saying they had never seen one before.
• This is a great and informative thread. Most of this stuff is new to me. I've always been taught man-made diamonds were totally impossible. I've secretly entertained the idea about making a machine that spits out diamonds, in the same way that I secretly entertain ideas about making a time-machine (not a clock) or some other fantastic device.
• If you buy a Canadian diamond, it might have come from disputed native land, but it will not have been associated with child labour or civil war.
• Nor will an Australian one. Not in a fit.
• 1) There is absolutely no shortage of diamonds. In fact, there is a glut which DeBeers absorbs by warehousing them. This is true. DeBeers keeps a pretty sizeable stockpile of diamonds, which they use to manipulate market prices. If they think that, say, the prices on .75 carat princess cuts, H-K color, SI clarity are too low, then they start holding them back. If they want to drive prices down to stimulate interest, they flood the market. However, I'd say that categorizations of diamonds as so common as to be worthless are a gross oversimplification. Rarity depends on size and quality. The sheer labor to produce a single finished, gem quality, full carat diamond is staggering -- you have to move something like a hundred tons of earth to get that one carat rock. Having said that, diamonds would be considerably less expensive if it weren't for DeBeers. In the last few years, there have been some rumblings from inside DeBeers that they're reconsidering this position. They're understandably loath to give up such a controlling position, but it presents two major obstacles: First, their stockholders aren't as content as they used to be. If the market didn't do well in the past, DeBeers could point to the stockpile and say "Don't worry." This is working less and less, if what I've read is to be believed. Second, DeBeers really, really wants to open operations here in the US. They want major offices here, and they're thinking about retail mall stores. But there's a problem there -- if ever there was a poster company for antitrust suits, DeBeers is it, so they're afraid to come here. Even in the current corporate-friendly climate, there's a substantial risk for them. So there could be a huge incentive for them to restructure their business. To be continued...
• 2) Because of the artificiality of the market, large jewelers apparently don't pay DeBeers up front for diamonds. They are given a shipment 'on consignment' and then pay once they've sold them. As a result, there's no incentive for most jewelers to buy used rocks when they're already getting the new ones for free (at least until they've sold). This is a bit oversimplified. There are many levels here, as you might expect. For one thing, a whole lot of jewelers don't deal directly with DeBeers. No, the big boys won't deal with you, and that's only one reason why you shouldn't do business with the big boys. IMO, independent jewelers who can do their own manufacturing and repair are a much better choice for about a half dozen reasons, but I have some bias there. The process is called receiving diamonds "on memo", and different sightholders work it different ways. Some will only memo stones to you if you specifically request them for a customer (and then want them back immediately), others will send you a shipment to keep in stock for a period of time, and you pay them as you sell them. As far as the little guy retailers go, this has nothing to do with artificiality and everything to do with the high risk and overhead of running your own retail jewelry business -- operating costs alone in the US average about 40% of retail volume. Mind you, that doesn't include cost of stock, just operating costs like payroll and insurance. The little guys prefer to do business with those who will reduce their costs. There are a lot of independents, however, who will be willing to either sell your piece on consignment or buy it outright from you. YMMV depending on area, of course. But you won't get nearly what you paid for it that way. Mostly because people who buy non-antique used jewelry will only buy it if it's a good bargain. If you get 30% of what you paid for it from the jeweler, you're doing pretty well. You'll get the most out of it if you sell it to someone else to wear -- in that case, expect no more than about 50-60% of what you paid. The best option is to deal with a jeweler that will let you trade on large diamonds that you buy from them. Many will give you store credit for what you paid for the diamond, as long as it isn't damaged, so you can trade that old wedding ring in for other stuff. Like a nice Patek Philippe to give me for Christmas, for instance.
• Oh, one final option that I always used to recommend to customers, SideDish: Take your ring to an established, independent place that has its own shop and can do its own manufacturing. They can take the stones out of your old wedding set and make something new for you -- a cocktail ring, pendant, bracelet, whatever. If you can separate the diamond from the ex in your mind, you got yourself a new piece of jewelry.