November 16, 2004

• is there another link to this story? The Hannity/Coulter book deal ad at the left of this one is making me a little barfy.
• The speech was part of a celebration of the opening of University of Chicago Comer Children's Hospital. Appropriate venue for such jokes, I'm sure.
• Um, there's no story to this "story." This is a joke Keillor wrote for PHC as part of his opening schtick last week. Maybe I shouldn't be, but I'm amazed any "news" site considers this newsworthy. It was a political jab, nothing else.
• Well, I think real world policy making based on eschatological premises is inherently flawed. Just because you think everyone will go to heaven if we do X, doesn't mean that X is a good idea, particularly if going to heaven is the only salient benefit of doing X. Primarily because there is a good chance that Heaven doesn't exist, and secondly even if it does, there is a good chance no one has any idea what will and won't get you into heaven. To claim otherwise is tantamount to blasphemy. Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, Render unto God what is God's. God has the whole immortal immaterial soul part under control, leave issue of the corporeal manefestations of the same to Caesar, or his bureaucratic, democratically elected, separated from the church, representatives. Get the pope out of government, and get jerry falwell out as well. They are precisely equivalent in the destructiveness.
• Humorist/author tells joke, his political enemies can't tell it was a joke. Nothing to see here.
• Someone legislate these assholes a sense of humor. Seriously, when have Christians been "disenfranchised" from anything? The only example I can think of is the Roman Empire and that was 2000 years ago. Time to move on, folks. Equating this joke with taking the vote away from blacks is cruel irony, given the KKK's Christian foundation. Totally inappropriate.
• HOMER: (pounding on TV) BE- MORE- FUNNY! BE- MORE- FUNNY!
• Americans are weird.
• I especially enjoyed this article on the internets web page of worldnet. So a gun owner, a rabbi, and priest walk into a courthouse...
• ))) drjimmy!!!!
• Equating this joke with taking the vote away from blacks is cruel irony, given the KKK's Christian foundation. That's kind of harsh... I mean, it would only be ironic if Christianity's foundation was the KKK, not the other way around. Seriously, when have Christians been "disenfranchised" from anything? You're right, it doesn't happen much at all these days, but they feel that its happening, which is often more of a motivator than reality. But feelings of persecution are bound to exist in any group which sets itself apart.
• See, that's why the Republicans have co-opted the the christian conservative meme. Always persecuted, yet still in power. Republican agenda, Born again values. S when Democrats say the Republican agenda is problematic, they are being attacked, because christians are always being attacked for their values... It's the perfect foil.
• The perfect foil for the cheap labor, war corporatist Repuiblican agenda.
• I can't find an official written transcript of the remarks. But I think the audio is part of segment 1 of the Nov. 6 Bonus Joke show, maybe under "GK talks about the election"
• That's kind of harsh... I mean, it would only be ironic if Christianity's foundation was the KKK, not the other way around. My point is that Christians are not historically tolerant people, and the KKK is one current demonstration of "Christian tolerance", particularly as applied to non-whites. So saying that this joke is equivalent to demonstrated, deliberate disenfranchisement of black people is an insult to everyone who's been involved in civil rights over the last five decades. Its like smokers invoking Hitler anytime they light up in non-smoking areas. I'd say 99.9% of Christians out there need to drink a tall, cool glass of Perspective on this one.
• Boring comedian gets tired guffaw; misunderstood by fascists and fundies
• Alex: Thanks for elaborating on that - I agree.
• This raises some questions for me. What does it consist of, being a born-again Christian, theologically speaking? Should I make this a curious george? Or just ask google?
• Excellent post
• The phrase comes from some translations of...the Gospel of John, IIRC (I'm a little rusty -- it's been years since I was a Baptist). Different denominations use the term in different ways, but generally it's used to refer to the belief that in salvation, your old sinful self dies and you are reborn as a new being, a child of God/part of the body of Christ/etc. Some baptism rites (by immersion, not sprinkling) sort of underscore this -- going under the water, you are identified with Christ in death and burial; in emerging from the water, you're identified with Christ in resurrection.
• Wikipedia: "Born again."
• My first reaction is, "these morons should get a sense of humor." But really, they know it's a joke. This is just more of the nasty hatemongering that the right has been doing for quite a while now. They're trying to get people riled up about that horrible Liberal NPR. Expect a wave of screeds about how our tax money is being used to help fund liberal hate speech any time now.
• Conservatives save quotes like these and use them to counter claims about quotes coming from conservative politicians. So complain that a Senator from South Carolina does not believe that gays and unwed, pregnant women should be allowed to teach, and they will counter with a quote from Garrison Keillor.
• what if you're a born again Keillorite?
• Somebody is going to get their panties in a bunch over this.
• Whoops. Someone forgot to tell them it was a joke. Siiigh. :P
• So now it's okay for Savage to have a radio show, but not Keillor?
• And somehow Rush gets a free pass when he talks about "putting the last liberal in a museum".

• Get the pope out of government, and get jerry falwell out as well. They are precisely equivalent in the destructiveness.

  Much though it pains me to say nice things about this Pope, I should say that he's a lot better than Jerry Falwell. The Catholic Church doesn't buy into that whole Young Earth Creationist anti-science bullshit, for starters.
• Said it before and I'll say it again: around 75% of Americans self-identify as Christians. I don't have my panties in a bunch over this one... and the reactions of Worldnet and Free Republic, the only cited sources of reaction, don't say a lot about who might. But blaming this election on Christians is getting very stale. The facts that it is inaccurate and has no chance of doing any benefit for the prospects of future rectification of our current imbalance of government power ought to be enough to convince anyone who actually gives a rat's ass about changing things to give it a rest. Which makes me wonder what a lot of people are really trying to accomplish. Is there anyone reading this who is actually blind to the fact that these general attacks on Christians, along with all the South bashing, red-state bashing, and rural bashing, is playing directly into the strategy of the current GOP? That more than one or a few particular issues, the biggest play they're getting is out of the sense of division and separation a host of issues and buzzwords and pandering creates? Try this one on for size: maybe instead of having a wry chuckle at taking the vote away from Christians, we should all be having a serious conversation about taking the power away from the incompetents running the DNC. The Democratic Party lost this election.
• what if you're a born again Keillorite? You mean they were born the first time around?
• "As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron." H. L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
• and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron Jeebers, that burns.
• Oooh, snap!
• Jeebers, that burns. I don't think people used curse words back in the old days.
• What nanojath said.
• the reactions of Worldnet and Free Republic Here's a more nuanced reaction.
• Is there anyone reading this who is actually blind to the fact that these general attacks on Christians, along with all the South bashing, red-state bashing, and rural bashing, is playing directly into the strategy of the current GOP? Agreed. I think there's a battle that could be fought on the religious turf by Democrats, yea, even lib'ruls, for the "hearts and minds" of the US voters. For instance, I have an extremely reductionist formula that I'm kinda in love with, WRT the difference in philosophy between the right and the left. Ergo, the Left seems to boil down to "We're All In This Together, So We Should Help One Another Out," whereas the Right seems to condense to "Everyone Should Take Care of Himself" (at least as regards economic policy). I've presented this to friends of different political persuasions and neither side disagrees with it too much in my unscientific survey, though they tend to use framing devices like "The Tyranny of the Strong Over the Weak" versus "The Culture of Dependence." Anyway, I think liberals could fight on this. "Which do you like better: we're all in this together, or every man for himself? All Americans Help Americans, or You Get Yours and I'll Get Mine? More to the point, which philosophy do you think JESUS would like better?" There are moral issues that get lost under the abortion and homosexuality debates, issues important enough to Jesus that He ACTUALLY TALKED ABOUT THEM IN THE BIBLE. Things like looking after the poor--a moral issue. Blessed are the Peacemakers--a moral issue. Truth vs. Lying, that sort of thing. Don't be afraid of the moral issues, liberals. You can win on them as long as you don't rush to try to out Republican the Republicans. In the Best Wolf contest, the coyote can never beat the wolf, no matter how wolf-like he is. Change it to a coyote contest. Er, or something.
• Um. H.W. Bush said that he thinks that atheists shouldn't be considered citizens. Where was the hubub? The exchange appeared in the Boulder Daily Camera on Monday February 27, 1989. It can also be found in "Free Inquiry" magazine, Fall 1988 issue, Volume 8, Number 4, page 16. *Crickets*