July 20, 2004

Good mothers stop monkeys going bad.
posted by homunculus 20 years ago
  • From the post:...prenatal screening tests which ensure that infants at risk receive optimal mothering in their first two years of life. I can't comment on the rest of the world, but this will never happen in the US. We as a society, unfortunately, have no interest whatsoever in making sure anyone receives optimal mothering. It has long been presumed by pretty much everyone that good parenting prevents a host of subsequent societal ills (drug abuse, crime, mental illness, low educational attainment, etc., etc.), but in the US, at least, social support for parenting is minimal to nil at best. I hear things are different in Europe. Sad.
  • Now I think of it, I had a goodmother once, a fairy goodmother. ONly I forget what she turned me into.
  • Sad, and strange, considering that Motherhood is supposed to be one of the things everyone's in favour of. I hear apple pie isn't doing so well, either, mind you.
  • That's -- everyone's in flavour of, I presume, eh, Plegmund?
  • Bees has been on the plonk. Stay tuned.
  • Mmmmh, flavour . I'm going out to get an apple pie right now!
  • ...on the plonk... Story of my life, Wolof.
  • In related news, the study of rhesus monkeys successfully isolated the "cheeky" gene.
  • what's being on the plonk? that like being on your period or something? *britspeak challenged*
  • on the sauce schnockered pissed out of your tree three sheets to the wind shitfaced
  • Shellacked Lubed up Pissed as a newt Marinated Pickled Crocked
  • It just means "been drinking". It needn't mean "plastered". It's quite a mild expression, really.
  • "Plonk" = "cheap wine".
  • Whoops. Looks like I've been interpreting it wrong for years. Thanks :)
  • Seldom drink wine, cheap or otherwise. Whisky or ale, usually. But then, I get quite tiddly on words.
  • I'm sorry I missed this when it was on the front page, because I think that we could have a really interesting discussion about this. There are two sides to the issue as I see it: 1) Any mother will tell you that babies are born with their own personalities and desires, 2) There are lots of things that parents can do to guide their children's behavior. In the United States, people tend to look at both those issues as an either or proposition for the most part. Either it's the parents' (mom's) fault or it's the kid's fault. We look for simple answers (see: drugs, see: TV and games make kids evil, see: et al). The fact is that great kids come out of terrible homes and evil kids come out of great homes, so there is no clear answer on what's going on there. Studies like this really bother me because they deny that human beings are extremely complicated and individual organisms that react differently to different stimuli whether that stimuli is biological or environmental. I just don't see the point in trying to pin down these kinds of specifics when we would be better served to give support to both parents and children (including support for post-partum depression, parenting classes, funding for education and after school programs etc, etc) than by giving another reason to point our fingers at people when things go wrong.
  • I was gonna post on this, before all the plonky silliness got underway, but Kimberly nailed it better than I could have. This is a serious issue that we're all heir to. Just because you youngsters haven't had kids (yet) doesn't mean this won't matter to you in the future. The USA is one of the very few technological countries that doesn't make child welfare, health, education, and parenting skills into a well-funded priority, and our society suffers as a result.
  • Please do not think that I am disagreeing with the necessity of pre- and post- natal care for not only child but both parents (or more, or fewer, as the case may be). But I am curious as to how the quality of mothering (fathering, parenting) is to be judged and by whom. Basics are easy and obvious (go outside and play, read, socialise with family/friends, respite for parents, etc.) but the harder lines are also obvious. What is appropriate reading? When/if to talk about death/sex/drugs/etc? How much (or anything) is too much? Will boys really "be boys" or is that ADD? Etc. The notion of "correct mothering" is rife for abuse and distortion, I think, and a very dangerous meme to put out there or encourage.
  • I don't think anyone is espousing "correct" parenting or anything close to it. It would just be nice if people had the tools and encouragement to try to do their very best. As Kimberly said, every kid is different, and needs parenting different from any other kid. In some ways, the kid influences the parent to be the kind of parent the kid needs. There are no 'one-size-fits-all' answers.
  • [I pillaged the term "correct mothering" from the article linked; I did not and do not think that Kimberly or anyone else here were suggesting that kind of objective standard, but I stand by my statement that the concept even alone is potentially destructive]
  • The resources I was thinking about were things like communication classes where parents are taught how to approach their children rather than what, specifically to approach them about. What about the importance of pre-school education and intellectual stimulation? What about classes on proper health care and nutrition? Being a parent is a skill and not everyone has the same resources at their disposal. If we really want to talk about "family values" I think we should be paying more attention to supporting people who are trying to raise children and have families. I don't think that means we have to tell parents what to tell their children, but it could mean that we can help them find the tools to more easily raise their children themselves.
  • Kimberly: You go, Girl! *gets out Big Education Drum and begins beating furiously Mr. BlueHorse has worked for DoD for over twenty years. That time partially coincided with the schooling of the 4 BlueHorse children. I'm here to tell you that I participated in numerous bakesales to raise money for books, equipment, etc., but none of them were organized by the USAF. If ONE TENTH of the money that was WASTED by DoD could be put to education in this country .... Arrrgh! Never mind. *slams door *opens it a tiny crack But then, I get quite tiddly on words. See! Shinything and I KNEW he was pie-eyed stewed polluted potted swacked pixilated
  • I ♥ GramMa!
  • Bluehorse, growing up my (entirely un-evil and lovely) step-mother had copy of the classic poster in our house: "It will be a great day when schools have all the money they need and the airforce has to hold a bake sale to buy a bomber"