June 21, 2007

Colin Powell advising Barack Obama. Mr Powell, 70, who left office in January 2005 under a cloud left by the war in Iraq, has served three Republican presidents, but made clear that he is considering backing a Democrat to succeed his former boss, George W Bush.
posted by HawthorneWingo 17 years ago
  • Powell threw himself on a live grenade for Bush and probably destroyed any chance of having his own serious political career. Playing an advisory role for Obama is a good move for both men -- Powell gets to rehabilitate himself and Obama gets to look like he's able to listen to Republican voices without having to commit to some big role for Powell down the road.
  • Is it that surprising, really? Powell was the one token centrist in the administration... When I heard him speak a couple weeks ago, he made it quite clear that he disagreed with how the war was being run on a fundamental level. He simply put it out there that it was a civil war, that civil wars are to be left for the country itself to decide, so the U.S. should go home. Not a word about his role in bringing that war about, of course, nor any responsibility the U.S. may have to solve what it started, but whatever. That a gulf exists (*cough*) between his thinking and that of the administration -- it was bound to come out sooner or later. But her support is concentrated among poor blacks, many of whom are yet to be convinced that Mr Obama - who does not share the slave heritage of most black Americans - is one of their own. He does better with university educated voters, both black and white. So... Hilary Clinton, a rich white woman, knows more of the black experience than an African-American (in the most literal sense of the phrase)? I'd be willing to bet that Obama has been pulled over by the cops a hell of a lot more times than Hilary Clinton, or mistakenly asked to take people's bags up to their hotel suite. I'm sure he has a fairly good idea as to what being a black man in America involves...
  • Bad idea. Obama doesn't need the taint from this moral coward.
  • Has somebody kidnapped petes again?
  • A-Huhuh, he said "taint". "Moral coward"? Yeah, agreed. But maybe he can yet save his soul.
  • So... Hilary Clinton, a rich white woman, knows more of the black experience than an African-American (in the most literal sense of the phrase)? I'm not so sure that that's the thinking behind it. As a white woman, I'm sure I don't completely understand myself, but the poor and working-class black people I've known seem to have had a common distaste for what they perceive as fakery of any kind, especially from other black people. Even though I don't believe Obama is putting on any kind of veneer, he may subconsciously strike that chord within the working-class black community. If the working-class white community I grew up in is any kind of model, there probably isn't a lot of personal research going on that would counteract that perception. Although Mrs. Clinton is a rich white woman, she acts like they expect a rich white woman to act. So it's possible she may come across as being truer to herself. Anyhoo, I also think it's a good move for both of them. I've been torn about Powell for a long time. Way back when, he was one of the very few people in the Republican leadership I had any respect for. I could be wrong, but I always kind of got the feeling that his early support for the war was an attempt to make the best of what he must have known to be a bad situation, and that maybe he thought he could still exert a good influence over the White House from within the system.
  • TUM, on any given day, I swing between your interpretation and wondering if Powell hung in there to try to keep the situation from going nuk-u-lar. or was he a yes-man for BushCo? Originally I had a great deal of respect for him, now, not so much. I can't look at any politician without seeing "taint."
  • The thing that's hard to forgive is that Powell sold the lie. They used him because he was credible, and he let himself be used. He's got blood on his hands now. I hope he now spends the rest of his public life trying to make up for that.
  • Powell lost me in the aftermath of the invasion of Panama, where he went on the Sunday talk shows to demonize Noriega for being an animal sacrificing dope fiend. This was on the basis of some white powder and frozen headless chickens in his freezer. Turns out the powder was flour. Our man in Panama had the makings of fried chicken on ice. Powell never admitted there was a mistake. He's always sold the lie and never looked back. He's good at it.
  • Powell embodies the worst weakness of the military mind. Very few who are trained to believe that the highest good is to follow orders swiftly and efficiently and without question or debate can rise above this instinct when it becomes morally imperative that they do so. The reason that you, um, Underpants, and many others (myself included) once viewed Powell positively is because that is the image of him that was conveyed to us by the media. We never knew the man, just as we don't know ANYONE in Washington (or, dare I say it, anywhere else? but especially in Washington) until they reveal themselves by their choices and their actions. This is not a case of a "good man going bad" any more than John McCain (another man once viewed by many as a "good Republican" whose depths of character would never allow him to sink the the depths of the overt crooks and bastards) is, but rather yet more proof that one should never buy into the carefully-crafted and self-serving images we are sold by PR firms, campaign managers, and the utterly compromised media. It's painful, I know, but if we don't learn this lesson now, and absorb it fully, we are only letting ourselves in for even greater disasters in the future. These people are not characters on tv or in a movie, that we should try to like and root for (or boo and hiss at, depending upon the author's intent); they are real human beings, with motives, agendas, affiliations, histories, debts and obligations, and personal weaknesses and shortcomings (as well as strengths), and we MUST do a better job of seeing them for who they are BEFORE they do their damage.
  • Well said, Rushmc. Unfortunately, we can only judge by what is reported in the news. Ain't that a pisser?
  • John McCain was reported in the news. Google "Keating 5".
  • To this day, I can;t hear or read anything about John McCain without getting hungry for french fries.
  • mmmmmm, fries French or freedom, we gotcha covered.
  • I myself never had an opinion on Powell until he danced his silly dance in front of the U.N. At that moment I decided never to trust another word coming out of that man's mouth. About his media portrayal, I find it interesting that the American psyche is geared towards thinking of talking heads on the teevee as infallible father figures when in many (most?) other countries it is axiomatic that the slimiest of the slimeballs regularly appear in such shows. I don't blame the media entirely for their inexplicable influence on the zeitgeist -- entire generations of Americans have allowed themselves to become mere passive observers in the political process, having no thought of their own except to ditto whatever the Dan Rathers or the Rush Limbaughs said. Perhaps they have allowed themselves to become convinced that they are personally powerless, which is, admittedly, a most convincing illusion.
  • Pretty good comment, rushmc.
  • Powell was always a piece of shit. He helped whitewash the My Lai massacre (Wikipedia link: WARNING: graphic photos). He told Larry King something like "oh these things happen in war" or some such, so it really isn't surprising that he was cup bearer for the likes of BushCo. His main objective now is to wash his hands clean. It doesn't bode well for Obama, who I think despite all will become just another talk-loud-do-nothing Washington POS, specially if he's listening to colon.