September 02, 2004

Zell Goes Nuts. Zell Miller, a lifelong "Democrat" gives the keynote speech at the RNC and basically calls Kerry a homosexual communist child-molester. Then he gets a bit nutty with the host of "Hardball". Discuss.

Compare the speech with this one from Miller's web site. Or review some comparisons of his flip-floppery. What a freak.

posted by pete_best 19 years ago
  • Thursday morning, Miller may deny he was serious when he said all of that, but the semi-deranged expression on his face at that moment suggested he'd truly lost control.
  • Even better. Here's the video from the Hardball blog of Zell Miller challenging Chris Matthews to a duel. Just go down the page and click the picture of Miller and Matthews to watch the video. More Andrew Sullivan
    Remember who this man is: once a proud supporter of racial segregation, a man who lambasted LBJ for selling his soul to the negroes. His speech tonight was in this vein, a classic Dixiecrat speech, jammed with bald lies, straw men, and hateful rhetoric. As an immigrant to this country and as someone who has been to many Southern states and enjoyed astonishing hospitality and warmth and sophistication, I long dismissed some of the Northern stereotypes about the South. But Miller did his best to revive them. The man's speech was not merely crude; it added whole universes to the word crude.
    When diehard conservatives like the Sullen Man are turned of by Miller it is a bad call to bring him to the RNC. Atrios has photos of Miller and Cheney during their speeches. Man, you think they look just a little angry.
  • But Miller is a freakin' Democrat! I always knew that the Democrats were a bunch of racist warmongers, but I never expected them to come out and say it! I bet when Gillespie voted to give Miller the authority to give the keynote, he didn't expect that Miller would diregard all common sense and wage his keynote in such a catastrophic fashion. This is clearly not the Republicans' fault! Besides, the other speakers at the convention were much more respectable and well-behaved. No wonder everyone likes the Republicans.
  • Hee! Shades of Jim Jeffords... Regardless: Tempest, meet Teapot. If the Republicans win in November, it's not going to be because of Zell Miller; if the Democrats win, it's not going to be *in spite of* Zell Miller.
  • I'd be interested in reading the speech in the original German. kidding, kidding! I largely agree with Fes here.
  • Sullivan beat me to the punch on the Dixiecrat comment, ABSOLUTELY true. Five bucks says the freak jumps parties and gets a big ole ree-ward from the Pubs for this, maybe a lifetime supply of pork.
  • Damnit, I want to see the duel thing. But stupid MSNBC doesn't support my computer's operating system. There ought to be a law...
  • Quicktime version of Miller's Hardball appearance. Works on Linux (with mplayer), and MacOS X.
  • Hooray!
  • Hey! Where's the homosexual communist child-molester part?? I just read the damn speech and, like most political speeches, it was super boring. A little testy, but hardly the diatribe I'd expected. What gives?
  • Apparently the text of the speech doesn't quite match the force of the delivery (WMV).
  • Oops, I see that a video link has already been posted.
  • Yeah, this one's all in the delivery. Think Pacino's "flamethrower" speech at the end of "Scent of a Woman."
  • Separated at birth? (self-link)
  • He hasn't been a Democrat in years. They already paid whatever they paid for him a long time ago. Either that or he's just an angry, angry man. Is there any doubt he was (like all speakers) coached? Given the "spitballs" line I'll wager he wrote some of it, but the GOP Igors went too far when they injected him with a dose of the ol' Tianamen Square Juice just before the speech. Seriously, that was offensive to anyone with a sense that politics should be a discussion. That was baiting, mongering, ranting, and that crowd couldn't get enough. Here's hoping Kerry gets mad about it and kicks their sound-bitten, spinsane, dirty asses.
  • Here's a fun bit of information on Democrat Zell Miller.
    Senate Democrats would do well to follow the House's lead. Sure, their unity figures aren't far apart, but look deeper at the numbers and you'll see what I mean. Sen. Zell Miller (D-Ga.) voted against the Democratic position 91.5 percent of the time. Of course, many Democrats have written him off as being a full-blown Republican minus only the party label. But last year, Rep. Ralph Hall of Texas -- who recently left the Democratic Party and actually became a Republican -- voted against the GOP 49 percent of the time. And Sen. Lincoln Chafee (R-R.I.), considered a RINO (Republican In Name Only) by many conservatives, strayed from the party line just 28.8 percent of the time.
    People constantly ask that if Miller hates the Democratic Party so much (and they hate him) why does he stay?
  • Because he's a crotchety old bastard. "Hell no I ain't a-goin'! *ptui!*" His statement that John Kerry said he wouldn't go to war without backing from the UN doesn't bear out. Outright lie, misheard quote, fear and smear? Mmmmmmmm . . Fear and Smear.
  • People constantly ask that if Miller hates the Democratic Party so much (and they hate him) why does he stay? Because he is being an attention whore in a last gasp grab for notoriety before retirement. If Miller were to jump to the Republicans full boat, he's just another yes man in the party. As a Democrat, siding with the Republicans, he has the veneer of "important" and "controversial". All the Democrats can really do is not fund him, which matters little as he is retiring.
  • if Miller hates the Democratic Party so much [...] why does he stay? Because the alternative would be joining the Party of Lincoln. You know, Abraham Lincoln. The president who held Sherman's leash. Miller's generation hasn't yet forgotten Sherman.
  • Re: Al Pacino reference. If you want to hear Al in all his glory, watch a terrible movie like "The Recruit" where he belts out such jems as: I pity da fool! My dick's on fire! And lest we forget the homo-erotic subtext of: I like your styyyle.
  • Also enjoy some classic Pacino scenery-chewin' in "Heat" talking to Hank Azaria: Because she got a GREEAAAAAAT ASS! And you got your head allthewayup INIT!!
  • Hey, guess who loved Miller's speech and has positive things to say about his appearance on Hardball.
  • I give up. Who is that?
  • Why Nick it's the most popular blogger in the world (I know that to be true since I read it on his site) Glenn Reynolds.
  • Never heard of him. Is he some kind of Republican?
  • Apropos Pacino: The Al Pacino Soundboard
  • His statement that John Kerry said he wouldn't go to war without backing from the UN doesn't bear out. Outright lie, misheard quote, fear and smear? Fact. John Kerry, 1970: "I’m an internationalist. I'd like to see our troops dispersed through the world only at the directive of the United Nations." Now, that's an old quote. Thing is, though, that he's never said anything that contradicts it. If he came out tomorrow and said, "I have changed my mind," that'd be fine by me. You guys didn't like the speech. That's fine. (Saying the Sen. Miller called Sen. Kerry a "homosexual communist child-molester" is just fucking lame.) But the two speeches, especially Sen. Miller's, polled very well with the Luntz focus group of representative Ohio undecided voters. Like over-the-top, home-run, crazy-go-nuts good. There will have to be some scrolling involved to get you down to the point where they talk about the focus group. It starts with "We are joined right now by pollster Frank Luntz." The nut:
    LUNTZ:  Last question.  Show of hands very quickly.  How many of you are now more likely than when you walked in here to vote for Bush-Cheney because of what you saw tonight?  Raise your hands.  Three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10, 11 out of 17.
    Eleven out of 17 undecided Ohio voters said they were more likely to vote for the President because of two speeches. That's a very strong response. An opinion can never be wrong, of course... but do some of y'all maybe wanna take a second and re-think your reactions?
  • Eleven out of 17 undecided Ohio voters said they were more likely to vote for the President because of two speeches. Looks like Fear and Smear
  • I would point out that it is extremely likely that anyone undecided and in those groups has not exactly examined issues very carefully. As such, they are highly suggestive to strong rhetoric and short-term messages. I would bet you that those 11 will go home, watch a Kerry ad or an Edwards speech, and suddenly be more likely to vote for Kerry. I think that those odd folks known as the "undecideds" will vote for the candidate who has presented them with the most recent argument for himself. So we can't really know which way these people will go until election day. I have always thought that if a party spends more time mining the votes of their own party (remember, only half or so are even voting) and less time pursuing the "swing voters," then they would be spending their money much more wisely.
  • basically calls Kerry a homosexual communist child-molester That's not how I read it. He essentially claimed that Kerry amuses himself by raping elderly nuns with a splintery broomstick. Not the same thing at all.
  • On no! Eleven out of seventeen! Whatever shall we do!! Here's something to do: look at electoral-vote.com predicting that Kerry will win, despite losing both FL and OH. (And FL is in the margin of error.) Now you may disagree, but you cannot escape the fact that America is bigger than seventeen fucking undecideds in Ohio. Fuck Zell. He isn't worth half the breath wasted on him. The RNC will regret their decision yet.
  • Okay, let me get this straight. The polling doesn't matter because (1) undecided voters aren't as smart as Bernockle and (2) there aren't enough of them for Tensor. Wow. It's amazing you guys haven't gotten picked up by one of the networks yet. Your incisive, insightful commentary is not to be missed.
  • William Saletan on Zell Miller's speech.
    When patriotism is impugned, the facts go out the window. You're not allowed to point out that Bush shifted the rationale for the Iraq war further and further from U.S. national security
  • Wow. It's amazing you guys haven't gotten picked up by one of the networks yet. Your incisive, insightful commentary is not to be missed. Disparage my credibility all you want, if it gives you pleasure. I am not running for president; neither do I pretend to predict the outcome of this election. The fate of the election rests not in the hands of network anchors, and not in the hands of loudmouths on the Internet.
  • .. and hopefully not in the hands of Diebold.
  • I would point out that it is extremely likely that anyone undecided and in those groups has not exactly examined issues very carefully. Or perhaps they have examined the issues very, very carefully, but are sufficiently disgusted by their options that they're waiting to the last minute to commit themselves. That way they don't have to make excuses for their their chosen boy every time another turd pops out of his mouth, his running mate's mouth, or his 527's sound trucks. Not that I'd know anybody like that.
  • Now Diebold is something worth losing sleep over.
  • "Loudmouths on the Internet" Heh. After about five minutes it'd go from Kerry vs Bush to Console vs Mac vs PC. Then the Console party splits into three, (maybe four depending on whether or not the Dreamcast lobby still has any members) competing parties. Meanwhile the goths/furry/otherkin special interest group sneaks in with a new candidate, Soulbonded Cheney. The conspiracy groups get together and nominate the Reticulans, while various eldritch groups come together under the banner of Cthulthu. Our nice little two party system ends up collapsing into chaos with Gates vs Miyamoto vs Jobs vs Soulbonded Cheney vs Reticulans. Then Cthulthu eats everyone. For those of you who don't know what Soulbonding is, you don't want to. You'll be happier. I figure Cheney soulbonds with Lincoln. "The party of..." and all that.
  • As the lone surviving member of the Dreamcast Veterans for the Best Gaming Console Ever!!!, I have to say that I would vote Samba de Amigo for president in a heartbeat!
  • Yay Pez!
  • *Fes stretches out banner: "Welcome Old Ones!"*
  • Jeff is back? I thought he flounced off weeks back.
  • For those of you who don't know what Soulbonding is And yet you had to go and link to it. You fucker. *begs for the sweet surcease of amnesia*
  • Fact. John Kerry, 1970: "I’m an internationalist. I'd like to see our troops dispersed through the world only at the directive of the United Nations." Now, that's an old quote. Thing is, though, that he's never said anything that contradicts it. If he came out tomorrow and said, "I have changed my mind," that'd be fine by me. note: in 1970 kerry was fresh from vietnam, running for congress in massachusetts, and he made his remark in this light. do you seriously believe that it's a part of his platform now to get the un's "permission" on anything? if you do believe that, you'd be wrong. in a july speech before his acceptance of the democratic nomination, he used almost exactly the same language as bush and cheney with their "permission to defend" bullshit, as reported in the boston globe. try another strawman next time. like maybe "john kerry doesn't want to fund our troops." and do you really want to compare kerry and bush quotes from 1970? how 'bout "i didn't wanna blow my eardrum out with a shotgun, so i decided to better myself by becoming a pilot"?
  • I'm reasonably certain that goetter is an imaginary person to whom I am soulbonded.
  • Jeff, maybe Zell's speech was popular with some people, maybe a lot of people. That doesn't mean it wasn't batshit insane, or, as Jon Stewart said tonight, that it didn't appeal to the worst in people.
  • /starts stockpiling spitwads
  • You know, I'm beginning to wonder whether Miller wasn't engaged in some sort of ingeniously subtle reverse-psychology attack on the GOP with his batshit speech the other night and following interviews--that by going so completely over the top with hatred and bile, he was showing that this is what the GOP does, this is what they think, and actually TRYING to turn off the voters. At least, it'd be nice to think that... if I didn't know that Zell is crazier than a shithouse rat, as mah daddy used t'say.
  • Thanks for the quote Jeff, I found the link to Harvard Crimson Online where it continues with Kerry said he wanted “to almost eliminate CIA activity. The CIA is fighting its own war in Laos and nobody seems to care.” So yeah 1970 was a different world, where the US was engaged in a political, ideological war that had little to do with the kind of threats we face now. A 34 year old quote. I wonder what W was saying in 1970? Was it a request for more booze or coke? Was he hazing a new pledge or pissing on cars? The quote really underscores the point that Zell, Cheney and the rest are using sound bites and not reasoned arguments. Unpublicans have proven over and over that reasoned arguments don't win elections. It's antithetical to representative democracy, and true nonetheless. The bigger point is that the RNC knows people need to be fearful so that they will vote for this president who can't run on his record. Zell played right along by ranting through the media blowtorch to the 11 people in Ohio (who aren't going to dig up a quote from 1970 on the internet and try to find its context). It was cheap, weak, and freakishly aggressive. Just like the "homosexual communist child-molester" description.
  • Wow, I actually have to agree with Jeff Harrell. I thought that was a great speech. I mean I disagree with the guy. I thought that practically everything he said was wrong headed or flat out wrong. But the speech was really, really good. He was forceful, persuasive, used clear, punchy evidence. The speech was paced well, seldom flagging, and I didn't find myself tuning out or getting bored. He seemed angry, but righteously angry, as if genuinely alarmed by a real threat. He managed to seem like an ordinary guy while, at the same time, having genuine and unforced gravitas. It was quite the performance. I found it stirring and, if I didn't already disagree with most of his points, I would have found it persuasive. This is exactly the kind of speech I would have expected to see from somebody like Bush who, lets face it, is a very weak public speaker. I have to say, though, that I'm very disappointed by the tone of this thread. I mean this guy stood up and said that he wants a president who a) purports to lead the free world without paying attention to where it wants to go b) believes that only the soldier can make us free and only war can redeem us and c) understands himself to be an infallible emissary of God, and the best rebuttal you can come up with is 'yeah, but he kind of looks like Emperor Palpatine! Hur, hur, hur.' Come on guys!
  • Okay, let me get this straight. The polling doesn't matter because (1) undecided voters aren't as smart as Bernockle and (2) there aren't enough of them for Tensor. Not quite. If I told you that 11 out of 17 people pissed themselves nightly, would you then claim that 65% of American's wet themselves? Of fucking course not. But it has the same credibility as a random sampling of less than 20 people out of a voting population of 100,000,000.
  • It was quite the performance. I wouldn't disagree. But if we're going to resort to pure theatre during these events, I want disclaimers. (i.e. "Facts" are out-of-context inferences. Consult your local dictionary.) This isn't pro wrestling, it's a contest for who's going to order servicemen and women to die for their crusades. It deserves a more civilized and reasonable tone. Not a Dixiecrat fear-mongering hellfire pitch, even if it was amazingly effective on those 11 people in Ohio.
  • I saw something where the Repubs are distancing themselves from Miller, to the extent that he and his wife were dis-invited from prominent display during Dubya's speech last night. Could that be true?
  • Yes.
  • Has anyone noted that Zell Miller sort of looks like an evil Alan Alda in some of the video stills. Have we ever seen the two of them together? I think not!
  • You know what else Zell Miller totally looks like? A guy without a friend in the world.
  • Maybe they coached him wrong. "Yeah, go out there and really fire 'em up! Give 'em what they want!"
  • Go Jimmy. That's why I love you.